The Premier Online Community for Real Estate Appraisers!
-
Welcome to AppraisersForum.com, the premier online
community for the discussion of real estate appraisal. Register a free account to be able to post and unlock additional forums and features.
Global Economy Bursting?
- Thread starter Austin
- Start date
- Status
nm505
Member
- Joined
- Nov 7, 2008
- Professional Status
- Certified Residential Appraiser
- State
- New Mexico
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ppw5O-Vtxcs
Jeremy Rifkin, 'The Third Industrial Revolution'
"How lateral power is transforming energy, the economy, and the world."
Charlie Rose 06.01.12 [1080p] (video 10 min)
I am reading this book and may have more to say later when I have finished it but the gist is that Germany is already embarking on the Third Industrial Revolution (leaving us behind again). Angela Merkel (a trained physicist) is a convert and champion. Daimler (inventors that first put the internal combustion engine on wheels) is embracing fuel cell technology. They are already exporting green solar energy to France who has nuclear.
http://cleantechnica.com/2012/02/09/clean-energy-loving-germany-increasingly-exporting-electricity-to-nuclear-heavy-france/
What is the Third Industrial Revolution? According to Jeremy and Merkel, it is distributed energy facilitated by an energy internet. It would mean buildings would become power generators rather than one of the largest sources of energy users. Buildings currently use 40% of energy, Industry 32% and Transportation only 28%.
http://www.google.com/imgres?q=buil...h=83&tbnw=148&start=0&ndsp=18&ved=0CEUQrQMwAA
Why is Germany such an early adopter? ECONOMICS....jobs jobs jobs. They do not want to be dependent on world energy prices which can shut down an economy at $147/barrel.
While my solar panels provide over 100% of my electrical use and offset my heating bills to provide inflation protection (I don't care how high prices go), I still must buy gas. My Prius allows me to pass gas stations all day long at 50-52MPG but I must fill up eventually. If I can get a hydrogen fuel cell for my home (coming soon) to store my excess solar, I will be able to have an electric car or hydrogen car and be totally autonomous. I can sell any excess to the grid and be part of the new distributed network of energy. And, yes, energy efficiency counts. The cheapest barrel of oil is one that we have saved due to energy efficiency.
While we have considerable oil/gas resources, prices are set on the open market. I would like to see our oil/gas resources help us transition to a new energy future. We need oil/gas for plastics and fertilizers and so much more. I used to say that I wanted to save them for the military and police but the military is so far ahead of the rest of us because they get it.
“We’re moving away from it for one reason, that is it makes us better war fighters. We would never give these countries the opportunities to build our ships, our aircraft, our ground vehicles, but we give them a vote in whether those ships sail and whether those aircraft fly or those ground vehicles operate when we allow them to set the price and the supply of our energy and we’ve just got to move away from it.”...Secretary of the Navy, former Mississippi governor (and ambassador to Saudi Arabia) Ray Mabus
http://www.renewableenergyworld.com...litary-biofuels-new-thinking-on-finance-fuels
I see a bright bright future and am so excited. All we have to do is move along this path as quickly as the technology allows and welcome it rather than staying stuck in the past.
Jeremy Rifkin, 'The Third Industrial Revolution'
"How lateral power is transforming energy, the economy, and the world."
Charlie Rose 06.01.12 [1080p] (video 10 min)
I am reading this book and may have more to say later when I have finished it but the gist is that Germany is already embarking on the Third Industrial Revolution (leaving us behind again). Angela Merkel (a trained physicist) is a convert and champion. Daimler (inventors that first put the internal combustion engine on wheels) is embracing fuel cell technology. They are already exporting green solar energy to France who has nuclear.
http://cleantechnica.com/2012/02/09/clean-energy-loving-germany-increasingly-exporting-electricity-to-nuclear-heavy-france/
What is the Third Industrial Revolution? According to Jeremy and Merkel, it is distributed energy facilitated by an energy internet. It would mean buildings would become power generators rather than one of the largest sources of energy users. Buildings currently use 40% of energy, Industry 32% and Transportation only 28%.
http://www.google.com/imgres?q=buil...h=83&tbnw=148&start=0&ndsp=18&ved=0CEUQrQMwAA
Why is Germany such an early adopter? ECONOMICS....jobs jobs jobs. They do not want to be dependent on world energy prices which can shut down an economy at $147/barrel.
While my solar panels provide over 100% of my electrical use and offset my heating bills to provide inflation protection (I don't care how high prices go), I still must buy gas. My Prius allows me to pass gas stations all day long at 50-52MPG but I must fill up eventually. If I can get a hydrogen fuel cell for my home (coming soon) to store my excess solar, I will be able to have an electric car or hydrogen car and be totally autonomous. I can sell any excess to the grid and be part of the new distributed network of energy. And, yes, energy efficiency counts. The cheapest barrel of oil is one that we have saved due to energy efficiency.
While we have considerable oil/gas resources, prices are set on the open market. I would like to see our oil/gas resources help us transition to a new energy future. We need oil/gas for plastics and fertilizers and so much more. I used to say that I wanted to save them for the military and police but the military is so far ahead of the rest of us because they get it.
“We’re moving away from it for one reason, that is it makes us better war fighters. We would never give these countries the opportunities to build our ships, our aircraft, our ground vehicles, but we give them a vote in whether those ships sail and whether those aircraft fly or those ground vehicles operate when we allow them to set the price and the supply of our energy and we’ve just got to move away from it.”...Secretary of the Navy, former Mississippi governor (and ambassador to Saudi Arabia) Ray Mabus
http://www.renewableenergyworld.com...litary-biofuels-new-thinking-on-finance-fuels
I see a bright bright future and am so excited. All we have to do is move along this path as quickly as the technology allows and welcome it rather than staying stuck in the past.
Last edited:
Randolph Kinney
Elite Member
- Joined
- Apr 7, 2005
- Professional Status
- Retired Appraiser
- State
- North Carolina
Germany says solar energy is path to bankruptcy, yet Obama doubles US down on it
Read more: http://www.irishcentral.com/story/n...es-us-down-on-it-139770573.html#ixzz1mzJzpOXm
One of the biggest national investors in green energy, Germany, is coming to the realization that green energy is the path to bankruptcy. This is nothing short of blasphemy in the green world to even make a partial admission that solar power is not the panacea it was promised to be.
Germany invested gargantuan amounts of money in green energy, doling out more than 130 billion in subsidies to install solar systems and spends an additional 10 billion per year subsidizing existing solar installations.
Yet after all of this capital expenditure Germany has little to show in terms of reducing green house gasses and helping the country's power needs. Despite massive investment, solar power accounts for only 0.3% of Germany’s total energy...When the sun shines! To add insult to injury, Germans also pay the second-highest price for electricity in the developed world, due mainly to the fact they are heavily subsidizing green energy by adding the cost to everyone's utility bills.
In spite of this ominous sign that solar may be a technology that will not soon reach it's potential, President Obama has America on a headlong rush down the same path of energy broken dreams that Germany has found itself on.
The green energy price tag for America under the Obama administration, is reaching into the billions. When you consider the energy policies that choke off America from it's natural resources and the subsidies to green energy by adding the price tag onto consumers utility bills, we are talking more than billions and possibly trillions, in outright costs and damage to our economy.
President Obama should examine very closely what lead to Germany's decision to basically pull the plug on solar. President Obama has had plenty of red warning flags along this path he has us on, some of these flags have names like Solyndra and Evergreen Solar.
Another red flag is the cost of gasoline to Americans, in some areas it is hitting over 5.00 per US gallon. Expensive fuel will increase the price of everything Americans consume and take money out of their pockets at the exact time you want to encourage consumer spending. This could tip the American economy back into the recession, you tell us we are no longer in.
Read more: http://www.irishcentral.com/story/n...es-us-down-on-it-139770573.html#ixzz1mzJzpOXm
One of the biggest national investors in green energy, Germany, is coming to the realization that green energy is the path to bankruptcy. This is nothing short of blasphemy in the green world to even make a partial admission that solar power is not the panacea it was promised to be.
Germany invested gargantuan amounts of money in green energy, doling out more than 130 billion in subsidies to install solar systems and spends an additional 10 billion per year subsidizing existing solar installations.
Yet after all of this capital expenditure Germany has little to show in terms of reducing green house gasses and helping the country's power needs. Despite massive investment, solar power accounts for only 0.3% of Germany’s total energy...When the sun shines! To add insult to injury, Germans also pay the second-highest price for electricity in the developed world, due mainly to the fact they are heavily subsidizing green energy by adding the cost to everyone's utility bills.
In spite of this ominous sign that solar may be a technology that will not soon reach it's potential, President Obama has America on a headlong rush down the same path of energy broken dreams that Germany has found itself on.
The green energy price tag for America under the Obama administration, is reaching into the billions. When you consider the energy policies that choke off America from it's natural resources and the subsidies to green energy by adding the price tag onto consumers utility bills, we are talking more than billions and possibly trillions, in outright costs and damage to our economy.
President Obama should examine very closely what lead to Germany's decision to basically pull the plug on solar. President Obama has had plenty of red warning flags along this path he has us on, some of these flags have names like Solyndra and Evergreen Solar.
Another red flag is the cost of gasoline to Americans, in some areas it is hitting over 5.00 per US gallon. Expensive fuel will increase the price of everything Americans consume and take money out of their pockets at the exact time you want to encourage consumer spending. This could tip the American economy back into the recession, you tell us we are no longer in.
Randolph Kinney
Elite Member
- Joined
- Apr 7, 2005
- Professional Status
- Retired Appraiser
- State
- North Carolina
The California Sinkhole - Green Energy
California has made a full-blown commitment to reducing reliance on fossil-fuel energy and other limited resources.
Utilities are required to use solar, wind and geothermal sources for a third of their electricity supply by 2020, while owners of homes and businesses are being urged to install solar panels.
The state is mandating that automakers dramatically ramp up sales of battery-powered and other low-emission cars. It is imposing new cap-and-trade emission controls on business with hefty fees.
Essentially, the state is trying to force California into an entirely new economic structure, claiming, in Gov. Jerry Brown's words, that "California is positioned perfectly to reap the economic benefits that will inevitably flow."
But what of the costs?
Those cap-and-trade fees will add tens, if not hundreds, of billions of dollars in costs to California business. A feeding frenzy has begun in the Capitol over how to spend the windfall, although the Legislature's budget analyst warns the legal options are limited.
The state's three largest utilities recently filed policy papers with the state Energy Commission about the impact of green conversion on consumers' power rates, which already are among the nation's highest.
Pacific Gas and Electric said it has "overarching concerns" about conversion because it "contains very little information on the actual cost impact on customers and numerous -- and sometimes overlapping -- public policies regarding power supply and whether customers actually need the volume of power that utilities would be required to procure under these numerous mandates. We should ensure that our efforts to transition to an ever-cleaner energy supply do not saddle customers with ever-higher costs for decades to come."
Another, San Diego Gas and Electric, is going further. Its new general rate filing would impose a "network use charge" on those with solar systems to maintain the distribution grid. Or to put it briefly, the utility wants those who use less of its power to pay more for system upkeep, which seems counterintuitive.
It's just one of the financial consequences of going green.
How about all of those battery- and hybrid-powered cars? Automotive fuel consumption has been declining in California for decades, vis-a-vis vehicular mileage, as cars have become more fuel-efficient -- and that trend would accelerate under the state's new clean car rules.
But high-mileage cars have just as much impact on pavement and congestion as gas-guzzlers, and fuel tax revenues have flattened, leaving California with the nation's most congested and second roughest roads.
Going green may sound good, but like all other public policies, has unintended consequences that we ignore at our peril.
California has made a full-blown commitment to reducing reliance on fossil-fuel energy and other limited resources.
Utilities are required to use solar, wind and geothermal sources for a third of their electricity supply by 2020, while owners of homes and businesses are being urged to install solar panels.
The state is mandating that automakers dramatically ramp up sales of battery-powered and other low-emission cars. It is imposing new cap-and-trade emission controls on business with hefty fees.
Essentially, the state is trying to force California into an entirely new economic structure, claiming, in Gov. Jerry Brown's words, that "California is positioned perfectly to reap the economic benefits that will inevitably flow."
But what of the costs?
Those cap-and-trade fees will add tens, if not hundreds, of billions of dollars in costs to California business. A feeding frenzy has begun in the Capitol over how to spend the windfall, although the Legislature's budget analyst warns the legal options are limited.
The state's three largest utilities recently filed policy papers with the state Energy Commission about the impact of green conversion on consumers' power rates, which already are among the nation's highest.
Pacific Gas and Electric said it has "overarching concerns" about conversion because it "contains very little information on the actual cost impact on customers and numerous -- and sometimes overlapping -- public policies regarding power supply and whether customers actually need the volume of power that utilities would be required to procure under these numerous mandates. We should ensure that our efforts to transition to an ever-cleaner energy supply do not saddle customers with ever-higher costs for decades to come."
Another, San Diego Gas and Electric, is going further. Its new general rate filing would impose a "network use charge" on those with solar systems to maintain the distribution grid. Or to put it briefly, the utility wants those who use less of its power to pay more for system upkeep, which seems counterintuitive.
It's just one of the financial consequences of going green.
How about all of those battery- and hybrid-powered cars? Automotive fuel consumption has been declining in California for decades, vis-a-vis vehicular mileage, as cars have become more fuel-efficient -- and that trend would accelerate under the state's new clean car rules.
But high-mileage cars have just as much impact on pavement and congestion as gas-guzzlers, and fuel tax revenues have flattened, leaving California with the nation's most congested and second roughest roads.
Going green may sound good, but like all other public policies, has unintended consequences that we ignore at our peril.
nm505
Member
- Joined
- Nov 7, 2008
- Professional Status
- Certified Residential Appraiser
- State
- New Mexico
Hmmmm....your source "from the right" may have a political agenda. http://cleantechnica.com/2012/02/09/solar-pv-reducing-price-of-electricity-in-germany/
This article would suggest a different scenario. My PERSONAL experience is also different. You should try it. You would like it.
This article would suggest a different scenario. My PERSONAL experience is also different. You should try it. You would like it.
Randolph Kinney
Elite Member
- Joined
- Apr 7, 2005
- Professional Status
- Retired Appraiser
- State
- North Carolina
Germany’s sunshine daydream
http://www.sundayszaman.com/sunday/newsDetail_getNewsById.action?newsId=271836
COPENHAGEN -– One of the world’s biggest green-energy public-policy experiments is coming to a bitter end in Germany, with important lessons for policymakers elsewhere.
Germany once prided itself on being the “photovoltaic world champion”, doling out generous subsidies – totaling more than $130 billion, according to research from Germany’s Ruhr University – to citizens to invest in solar energy. But now the German government is vowing to cut the subsidies sooner than planned, and to phase out support over the next five years. What went wrong?
There is a fundamental problem with subsidizing inefficient green technology: it is affordable only if it is done in tiny, tokenistic amounts. Using the government’s generous subsidies, Germans installed 7.5 gigawatts of photovoltaic (PV) capacity last year, more than double what the government had deemed “acceptable.” It is estimated that this increase alone will lead to a $260 hike in the average consumer’s annual power bill.
According to Der Spiegel, even members of Chancellor Angela Merkel’s staff are now describing the policy as a massive money pit. Philipp Rösler, Germany’s minister of economics and technology, has called the spiraling solar subsidies a “threat to the economy.”
http://www.sundayszaman.com/sunday/newsDetail_getNewsById.action?newsId=271836
COPENHAGEN -– One of the world’s biggest green-energy public-policy experiments is coming to a bitter end in Germany, with important lessons for policymakers elsewhere.
Germany once prided itself on being the “photovoltaic world champion”, doling out generous subsidies – totaling more than $130 billion, according to research from Germany’s Ruhr University – to citizens to invest in solar energy. But now the German government is vowing to cut the subsidies sooner than planned, and to phase out support over the next five years. What went wrong?
There is a fundamental problem with subsidizing inefficient green technology: it is affordable only if it is done in tiny, tokenistic amounts. Using the government’s generous subsidies, Germans installed 7.5 gigawatts of photovoltaic (PV) capacity last year, more than double what the government had deemed “acceptable.” It is estimated that this increase alone will lead to a $260 hike in the average consumer’s annual power bill.
According to Der Spiegel, even members of Chancellor Angela Merkel’s staff are now describing the policy as a massive money pit. Philipp Rösler, Germany’s minister of economics and technology, has called the spiraling solar subsidies a “threat to the economy.”
Randolph Kinney
Elite Member
- Joined
- Apr 7, 2005
- Professional Status
- Retired Appraiser
- State
- North Carolina
Green energy is under threat
http://pellets-wood.com/green-energy-is-under-threat-o7755.html
Once the EU decided to stop subsidizing alternative energy, many countries began to wind down in the production of green energy and started to raise fares.
Spain, Italy, Germany and other members of the EU reveal solidarity in the gradual abolition of the favoring policies.
In Italy, the law now prohibits the construction of alternative power plants with capacity over 1 MW, and a promotional fare is canceled for the period from 2011 to 2013.
In the UK analysts are concerned about the fact that many people remain unemployed, and the company goes bankrupt if it is forced to suspend production.
Germany plans to reduce the production of green energy up to 1 gigawatt per year, and since the beginning of the year subsidy from the state is considerably reduced. Reduction of financial support will contribute to higher prices in the market and the appearance of several new companies which will be able to compete.
http://pellets-wood.com/green-energy-is-under-threat-o7755.html
Once the EU decided to stop subsidizing alternative energy, many countries began to wind down in the production of green energy and started to raise fares.
Spain, Italy, Germany and other members of the EU reveal solidarity in the gradual abolition of the favoring policies.
In Italy, the law now prohibits the construction of alternative power plants with capacity over 1 MW, and a promotional fare is canceled for the period from 2011 to 2013.
In the UK analysts are concerned about the fact that many people remain unemployed, and the company goes bankrupt if it is forced to suspend production.
Germany plans to reduce the production of green energy up to 1 gigawatt per year, and since the beginning of the year subsidy from the state is considerably reduced. Reduction of financial support will contribute to higher prices in the market and the appearance of several new companies which will be able to compete.
nm505
Member
- Joined
- Nov 7, 2008
- Professional Status
- Certified Residential Appraiser
- State
- New Mexico
Will research more. I had a 12 year payback when I did my solar installation but now that solar prices have fallen so much due to the Chinese which killed Solyndra's GREAT technology, I would probably only have an 8 year payback or less. It just makes sense. Trust me...I love EXCEL. I don't do anything that doesn't make financial sense. Would you like to hear about my energy saving H20 boiler? No? Just want to keep on wasting our precious energy. Oh well.
Randolph Kinney
Elite Member
- Joined
- Apr 7, 2005
- Professional Status
- Retired Appraiser
- State
- North Carolina
Market for Solar Power Shrinks
https://www.friedlnews.com/article/market-for-solar-power-shrinks
The Austrian renewable energy market showed a substantial slump in 2011. Subsidies were cut considerably.
Already one out of seven single family homes is equipped with a solar energy plant. Only Israel, Cyprus and Barbados have more solar collectors per head, says Roger Hackstock at Verband Austria Solar.
However, for the second time in a row, the Austrian solar market shrinked. This is mainly resulting in a cut in subsidies in Lower Austria, which is the biggest inner-Austrian market for solar collectors. Before, the subsidy reached 30% of the investment sum. Last year, 240,000 square meters of solar collectors were built, which is a decline by 15%. In Lower Austria, the installation of solar power plants was down by 70%.
On average, prices for solar power plants were down by 10%. The amortization is expected after ten to fifteen years, assumed that oil and gas prices increase as strong as in the last ten years, Hackstock says. In 2011, 80% of the produced solar collectors were exported. The production volume reached 1.3 million square meters. By contrast, the import quota amounted 5.0%.
Hackstock explains that Austrian producers fear competition arising from China. In the solar collector market, Chinese competition is not as aggressive as in the photovoltaic market, says Hackstock. “They still do not have the same technologic level.” Nevertheless, China is seen as potential threat. “Austria and Germany must watch the Chinese competition very sharply.”, Hackstock concludes.
https://www.friedlnews.com/article/market-for-solar-power-shrinks
The Austrian renewable energy market showed a substantial slump in 2011. Subsidies were cut considerably.
Already one out of seven single family homes is equipped with a solar energy plant. Only Israel, Cyprus and Barbados have more solar collectors per head, says Roger Hackstock at Verband Austria Solar.
However, for the second time in a row, the Austrian solar market shrinked. This is mainly resulting in a cut in subsidies in Lower Austria, which is the biggest inner-Austrian market for solar collectors. Before, the subsidy reached 30% of the investment sum. Last year, 240,000 square meters of solar collectors were built, which is a decline by 15%. In Lower Austria, the installation of solar power plants was down by 70%.
On average, prices for solar power plants were down by 10%. The amortization is expected after ten to fifteen years, assumed that oil and gas prices increase as strong as in the last ten years, Hackstock says. In 2011, 80% of the produced solar collectors were exported. The production volume reached 1.3 million square meters. By contrast, the import quota amounted 5.0%.
Hackstock explains that Austrian producers fear competition arising from China. In the solar collector market, Chinese competition is not as aggressive as in the photovoltaic market, says Hackstock. “They still do not have the same technologic level.” Nevertheless, China is seen as potential threat. “Austria and Germany must watch the Chinese competition very sharply.”, Hackstock concludes.
Randolph Kinney
Elite Member
- Joined
- Apr 7, 2005
- Professional Status
- Retired Appraiser
- State
- North Carolina
SunShot Makes Solar Energy a Long Shot
http://oregoncatalyst.com/15030-sunshot-solar-energy-long-shot.html
President Obama’s Fiscal Year 2013 budget includes $310 million for an ongoing energy research program called SunShot. The goal of the program is to use taxpayer subsidies to reduce the total installed cost of solar energy by 75% by the end of this decade, making it cost-competitive with other sources.
This is an admirable goal, but linking it to ongoing subsidies virtually guarantees that it won’t be met. There is no reason for private companies to develop inexpensive technology when politicians keep giving away money each year for research.
We’ve already seen this approach fail in Oregon. In 1999, the state legislature passed a law requiring that most consumers pay a three percent surcharge on their monthly electric bills to subsidize “market transformation” for renewable energy. Legislators and lobbyists agreed that the tax – which came to be known as the “Public Purpose Charge” – would go away after ten years, at which time green power was expected to be cost-competitive with coal and natural gas.
The ten-year anniversary of the Public Purpose tax will arrive on March 1, and solar energy is still wildly uncompetitive with other sources. And not surprisingly, politicians have reneged on the promise to end the tax; it was quietly extended five years ago to 2026 by the legislature, with no public discussion. This will cost consumers billions of dollars.
http://oregoncatalyst.com/15030-sunshot-solar-energy-long-shot.html
President Obama’s Fiscal Year 2013 budget includes $310 million for an ongoing energy research program called SunShot. The goal of the program is to use taxpayer subsidies to reduce the total installed cost of solar energy by 75% by the end of this decade, making it cost-competitive with other sources.
This is an admirable goal, but linking it to ongoing subsidies virtually guarantees that it won’t be met. There is no reason for private companies to develop inexpensive technology when politicians keep giving away money each year for research.
We’ve already seen this approach fail in Oregon. In 1999, the state legislature passed a law requiring that most consumers pay a three percent surcharge on their monthly electric bills to subsidize “market transformation” for renewable energy. Legislators and lobbyists agreed that the tax – which came to be known as the “Public Purpose Charge” – would go away after ten years, at which time green power was expected to be cost-competitive with coal and natural gas.
The ten-year anniversary of the Public Purpose tax will arrive on March 1, and solar energy is still wildly uncompetitive with other sources. And not surprisingly, politicians have reneged on the promise to end the tax; it was quietly extended five years ago to 2026 by the legislature, with no public discussion. This will cost consumers billions of dollars.
- Status