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Incorrect Acreage on VA Appraisal

Many people that live on way more land than the house they live in have their house and lot surveyed out of the larger parcel in order for the bank to get a mortgage on their house and lot. They don't want the bank taking a mortgage on all of their land, so they survey out their House and lot on a smaller parcel of land.

These two lots already have separate legal descriptions in the veteran's case.

Even if the bank has a mortgage on both lots, you could sell one by itself or not. You would probably have to refinance if you wanted to sell the extra lot and get the bank to release the second lot.

VA would probably approve releasing one lot from the mortgage. I don't know about the bank.

It could be sold to FNMA or Freddie soon, so refinance would probably be your only option if you wanted to sell the extra lot separately.

I take that back. You could pay the mortgage off and sell them as you wish.

I know. If your a veteran, you understand stress. A mortgage is a stress.

Your doing good. You have nothing to worry about on this purchase personally.

I won't swear other professionals that may have helped you don't have something to worry about.

Let me name a few professionals that might have helped you. Licensed real estate lawyers..........Bank employee/broker............home inspector...........title insurance company..............home warranty company........real estate agents for seller/and you.

I named a few professionals that were involved in your purchase. I hoped I helped you.
 
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Hi, Thank you all for your thoughts. My takeaway is I have no reason to worry.

@shrubberyvaluation My initial thoughts were the same about my liability. Also, like you I am not a lawyer, nor an appraiser so I asked my question to see if my initial thoughts were correct.

@TerryRohrer I am also curious about what the value is of both properties. There is another vacant lot the same size as mine in the same subdivision, about 1/4 mile away, that is listed & on the market for 90 days at $210,000. 14 months ago two vacant lots about 3 miles away, the same size as mine and the other listed in the same subdivision, both sold for $160,000 each, per my Realtor. The listing of being unsold at $210,000 for 90 days yet two sales at $160,000 each give me confidence the vacant lot I just bought has a value of $160,000, and that if revised, my appraisal should come in with a higher value.

@Zoe I reviewed the closing docs and there are two separate settlement docs: one for the house and one for the vacant lot, with each doc referencing the appropriate separate legal description. There is a title fee on each separate settlement doc, while the house settlement doc also has a lenders title policy fee. I confirmed with the title company there are two separate title insurance policies. There is no mortgage on the $5 vacant lot as the mortgage is just for the house since the request for appraisal was only for the house. The issue is the Appraiser referenced the MLS listing and not the purchase agreement; the MLS listing stated the total combined acreage of both the house and vacant lot. The MLS listing did not state the total MLS listed acreage was a total of two separate deeded lots that the sellers required to be purchased simultaneously.

@Tom D You are correct in what the mortgage company told me. They had never heard of such an issue and they believe it is an Appraiser problem only so to just not worry about it, and to take a wait & see approach. Our mortgage broker just wanted to give me a heads-up in case I got a phone call or email from someone about this. However, worrying is second nature to me and having semi-solid plans in my head as to what actions to take when an issue arises helps lessen the worry.

@J Grant I am unsure how you interpreted my question as to me complaining. I hope to accomplish gaining knowledge and an understanding of any liability I may face for the Appraiser putting the total combined acreage of two separately deeded properties on his appraisal, relying upon the MLS listing instead of the purchase agreement to obtain the acreage. No, I do not want to back out of the deal and get my money back. Again, I am unsure how you came to that conclusion. You are correct: the Appraiser put the total acreage on the appraisal and now realizes the lot for the house alone is smaller, and that the site across the street makes up the rest of the acreage. Per our mortgage broker, the new mortgage loan only encumbers the house, not the vacant lot. I asked my mortgage broker if it was possible the appraiser overvalued the property by reporting the lot size as "bigger" on the appraisal when the primary lot the house was on was smaller in size. Her reply was that she is not an appraiser but after 35 years in the mortgage business and reviewing hundreds of appraisers, it looked to her the five comps in our appraisal support our appraised value even if the acreage in our appraisal is reduced. What is interesting is the appraiser included in our appraisal one page of vacant land sales and current listings, which clearly show our vacant lot to be valued at a minimum of $160,000.

@CGinMN After reading the answers on this thread and doing further review on my own, I am leaning towards your opinion.

@Tim Hicks (Texas) The statement was to address the sellers desire to sell both properties simultaneously; nothing more, nothing less. They did not want to have two separate MLS listings, two separate sales, etc. They wanted a “one and done” transaction so yes they were sold together, but are deeded separately. The two Realtors worked together with the wording, the mortgage broker ran it by her companies underwriting department to ensure it was clear, and it was approved. It was explained to me to be similar to a contingency of a buyer having to sell their current house to buy, etc. “Action A has to occur before action B, the purchase, can occur”. There were two separate settlement docs and there are two separate title policies. The appraisal request was only for the house, not the vacant lot. You are correct about needing two separate appraisals, and this is what the mortgage broker told us also. However, the purchase agreement was written so that the entire asking price in the MLS listing was agreed upon for the house, with the vacant lot being sold for $5. The sellers agreed and we were all unsure the appraisal would support the agreed upon asking price. However, the appraisal value did support just the house. Everybody was happy at this point and therefore we moved forward & closed. The sellers sold both properties simultaneously for their combined asking price, we had an appraisal supporting the asking price for just the house, a mortgage for the house, and a vacant lot for $5. For some reason, late in the afternoon on the same day that both the buyers, and the sellers signed & closed and the mortgage company disbursed the funds, the Appraiser called our mortgage broker’s assistant to tell him of the discrepancy in the acreage on the appraisal. This concerned the mortgage broker assistant, who called his broker, who notified me, and started me worrying. My worrying is what prompted this post as I was hoping to gain enough knowledge to calm my nerves. I believe now there is no reason for me to worry.
I agree. Surprised no one has mentioned the "Marketable Entity" aspect from the VA Lender's Handbook,
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I agree. Surprised no one has mentioned the "Marketable Entity" aspect from the VA Lender's Handbook,
View attachment 93623
See, that really does not impact the veteran. But from H&B use issue it could create a problem on MV appraisal. Do you agree?

VA would likely approve it if appraiser said the highest and best use was for the parcels to be sold separately MV appraisal.

You agree?

Give me a minute. I will post MV definition for this veteran.
 
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Definition of Market Value​

Market value is the most probable price that a property should bring in a competitive and open market under all conditions requisite to a fair sale, the buyer and seller, each acting prudently, knowledgeably and assuming the price is not affected by undue stimulus. Implicit in this definition is the consummation of a sale as of a specified date and the passing of title from seller to buyer under conditions whereby:

  • buyer and seller are typically motivated;
  • both parties are well informed or well advised, and each acting in what they consider to be in their own best interest;
  • a reasonable time is allowed for exposure in the open market;
  • payment is made in terms of cash in U.S. dollars or in terms of financial arrangements comparable thereto; and
  • the price represents the normal consideration for the property sold unaffected by special or creative financing or sales concessions granted by anyone associated with the sale.
Note: Adjustments to the comparables must be made for special or creative financing or sales concessions. No adjustments are necessary for those costs that are normally paid by sellers as a result of tradition or law in a market area; these costs are readily identifiable because the seller pays these costs in virtually all sales transactions. Special or creative financing adjustments can be made to the comparable property by comparisons to financing terms offered by a third-party institutional lender that is not already involved in the property or transaction. Any adjustment should not be calculated on a mechanical dollar for dollar cost of the financing or concession, but the dollar amount of any adjustment should approximate the market’s reaction to the financing or concessions based on the appraiser’s judgment.


Referencing 1004 MV definition.
 
You know the market sets the most probable price in MV definition.
I'm confused by some of the information given by the OP in the post (see below). But I don't think the Veteran should worry about anything. No worries.
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@Zoe To answer your question, "Would you sell the two properties together or separately?" I would not sell the properties together. Possibilities in the future are:
1) not sell the vacant lot and
1a) leave it untouched, or
1b) drill a well and install a septic system to have the vacant lot be considered improved and ready to build, and future-proof against any County and/or State changes to wells & septics that would prevent them being placed on the property (has happened in another state where I lived), and keep the lot
2) sell the existing house & property, and then use the proceeds to help pay some of the cost of building a new house on the vacant lot for us to live in
3) sell the vacant lot and use the proceeds to pay down the new mortgage on the existing house & lot
4) sell the vacant lot to a family member for a reduced price

The market value, in my opinion which is based upon two other vacant land sales in mid-2023 a few miles away, and a current MLS listing about 1/4 mile away, is $160,000.

There were two separate purchase agreements, the appraisal request was only for the house and the lot it sits on no appraisal request was made for the vacant lot. I did not see any reason for the vacant lot to be appraised: I know the value is $160,000, I know from talking to the County that it is a separately deeded lot, it can have a well & septic placed upon it, it is sellable, and my mortgage broker has stated the new mortgage is only on the house & the lot the house is on, and the vacant lot is unencumbered by their mortgage company.

With today being a holiday there is no new news and as many have said, try not to worry, and see what questions, if any, come my way.

Thank you all again. It has done a lot to calm my nerves.
 
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@Zoe To answer your question, "Would you sell the two properties together or separately?" I would not sell the properties together. Possibilities in the future are:
1) not sell the vacant lot and
1a) leave it untouched, or
1b) drill a well and install a septic system to have the vacant lot be considered improved and ready to build, and future-proof against any County and/or State changes to wells & septics that would prevent them being placed on the property (has happened in another state where I lived), and keep the lot
2) sell the existing house & property, and then use the proceeds to help pay some of the cost of building a new house on the vacant lot for us to live in
3) sell the vacant lot and use the proceeds to pay down the new mortgage on the existing house & lot
4) sell the vacant lot to a family member for a reduced price

The market value, in my opinion which is based upon two other vacant land sales in mid-2023 a few miles away, and a current MLS listing about 1/4 mile away, is $160,000.

There were two separate purchase agreements, the appraisal request was only for the house and the lot it sits on no appraisal request was made for the vacant lot. I did not see any reason for the vacant lot to be appraised: I know the value is $160,000, I know from talking to the County that it is a separately deeded lot, it can have a well & septic placed upon it, it is sellable, and my mortgage broker has stated the new mortgage is only on the house & the lot the house is on, and the vacant lot is unencumbered by their mortgage company.

With today being a holiday there is no new news and as many have said, try not to worry, and see what questions, if any, come my way.

Thank you all again. It has done a lot to calm my nerves.
And what did you pay in total, for both parcels?
 
@Tiffany Gibbons I am unsure of your specific confusion but let me try to clarify.

The selling Realtor listed both properties in the MLS as one larger property. It was only upon our Realtor making an inquiry of the Selling Realtor did we learn there were actually two separate properties that would require two separate purchase agreements since were buying via obtaining a mortgage, as we were told by our mortgage broker and by our Realtor that one mortgage cannot be used to buy two separate deeded properties. Additionally, the Selling Realtor told us her clients, the sellers, would not sell the vacant lot separate from the house, and would not sell the house separate from the vacant lot. The sellers could have sold the vacant lot separate from the house as there is no reason they could not separate them but it was just their desire that they wanted to sell together. There was no issue until the Appraiser called stating he had appraised it as one larger property, and had not realized it was actually two separate lots, with the house being on the smaller lot. At this point all I can do is worry less and wait to see if anything comes my way.
 
@Tiffany Gibbons I am unsure of your specific confusion but let me try to clarify.

The selling Realtor listed both properties in the MLS as one larger property. It was only upon our Realtor making an inquiry of the Selling Realtor did we learn there were actually two separate properties that would require two separate purchase agreements since were buying via obtaining a mortgage, as we were told by our mortgage broker and by our Realtor that one mortgage cannot be used to buy two separate deeded properties. Additionally, the Selling Realtor told us her clients, the sellers, would not sell the vacant lot separate from the house, and would not sell the house separate from the vacant lot. The sellers could have sold the vacant lot separate from the house as there is no reason they could not separate them but it was just their desire that they wanted to sell together. There was no issue until the Appraiser called stating he had appraised it as one larger property, and had not realized it was actually two separate lots, with the house being on the smaller lot. At this point all I can do is worry less and wait to see if anything comes my way.
If the appraiser was even in the right ballpark in appraising the single lot for the entire purchase price, and you are even in the right ball park in your estimated value of the vacant lot, then the seller was clearly represented by a realtor without a clue who should be held accountable. Nor does it sound like your lender is much wiser. Such deals are done every day because appraisers won't do their jobs in most such cases. If an appraiser suggests they will provide credible appraisals of both tracts, the assignment is usually canceled and sent to a more compliant appraiser.
 
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