Is this house too "Loggy?"

[CANative]

Major lender, order from their AMC. Specific guidelines state that the atypical houses are not eligible for their loan program. The owner didn't mention something before I drove several hours to their place (as part of my regular route, but still...)

After getting back I called the AMC to discuss. The problem is that this house is partially a log house. It was originally a red cedar log kit house from Pan Abode built in 1964. But it's been extensively added on to. Rustic on the outside, very nice on the inside. I've appraised a number of these Pan Abode's but usually in the mountains in another county. None in this coastal area.

I only found two log home sales. Pricing seems to be about the same as any other rustic house in the woods with similar acreage (4 acres) But Holy Moses, the market times. One sold in 526 days and the other in 863 days. This is a less than 90 day market and has been for a very long time.

Now I'm conflicted and I'm thinking of just dumping this appraisal over the side. But I'm also thinking that only a small portion of the house is logs and the rest is rustic like most properties out here. I really need a vacation. My upcoming week of CE in Reno and a hotel/spa in Pleasanton is starting to look pretty good.

Here are some pictures. Any log house appraisers have an opinion?

 

[Jerry Bone Jr]

My opinion, do the appraisal.

 

[CANative]

I will.

It doesn't pay to post too fast here or to post before doing enough research.

My little log house comp sold in 45 days and needs a location adjustment. My other little log house comp that sold in over 500 days needs acreage, GLA and a "log cabin" adjustment. It obviously languished on the market due to overpricing (listed at $595k sold for $465k soon after price decrease)

Now form my best comp. 2200 sf Log house (subject is 2200+- sf) on same size parcel. 826 days on market. This is a sale from January 1999 and I was (am) going to use it to show that pricing for log houses is roughly similar to other rustic houses. But this date of sale was way before my time. After pulling sales of similar size houses in the same area on similar size parcels, during the same time period I found that everything was taking 550 to 750 days to market. Must have been a rough time for Realtors back then.

 

[VolcanoLvr]

Greg....

I'd be careful about calling this jewel a 'log' house. That will raise red flags.

We have these up here in the wild northwest. I think their factory is in Bellevue, WA.

Craft a carefully worded statement about the type of 'logs' that these are....not true logs, but off-site manufactured shaped logs that are milled in a factory from cedar. (Take corner shot photos to show the assembly.) These shaped logs are then brought to the site, and assembled much like a site-built home would be, on a standard poured cement foundation (presumed!).

For these, I generally give them a positive quality adjustment as compared to drywalled dwellings. The cache of the PanAbode is not quite as high as a true log home, but the maintenance for these is probably less due to the lack of chinking required and shrinkage of the true log home.

I usually don't go out of my way to compare these to a true log home from a comparable standpoint, since the construction is very different.

The best comparable is another Pan Abode if you can find any!

Dave

 

[Richard Carlsen]

Greg, I'd do the appraisal and let the lender make the determination if it is too atypical. Why should the appraiser be saddled with the responsibility of making those decisions? Your job is not to screen the properties for the lender but to appraise them.

The lender LO talks to the HO to get the application going. Why didn't he/she find out about the house in that conversation. It burns me no end when you get an order and you ask the lender if the property is on water or does it have acreage or is it manufactured and the lender say, "Gosh, I don't know." I wonder what they do when they talk on the phone to a HO? Probably spend all of their time figuring out their commission.

BTW, two log comps are enough. I feel lucky when I have that many. Often time we have to go into other markets 15 to 30 miles away to get an additional log house.

 

[Brad Ellis]

Greg,

I think your approach is correct and you can solve your problem by correctly rep0orting the overly long exposure times. Not many lenders will make that loan.

Dave,

Thanks for that info on Pan Adobe. Interesting.

Brad

 

[CANative]

Dave, whenever I appraise one of these, I usually start off the improvement description with something like thisw...

Subject improvements consist of a modified log home. Originally a kit home by Pan Abode with precut and notched red cedar logs which are assembled on site. If the client desires, more information can be obtained at http://www.panabode.com/home.html Originally about 700-800 square feet. The home has been extensively added onto with with wood framing and redwood siding and the home now has a more conventional design. Interior has been updated and very well maintained. Wood shingles on a portion of the upper story, the balance of roofing is newer comp shingles. Overall good condition. There is also a barn structure which can serve as a garage and equipment storage building.

Richard... It makes me so mad that clients and homeowners do this. The lender has a specific program that may exclude the type of improvements the homeowner has yet neither homeowner or client inform the appraiser that the house fits that description. What did they think? That I wouldn't notice it?

Brad..I've gridded 3 sales as comps 7,8 and 9. No adjustments to the subject because I am just show the relationship between those hisotrical sales to each other. I've cobbled a temporary set of comments as a place holder until I get back to it. Am I on the right track?

Due to a less than optimal amount of current market data for properties similar to the subject in terms of architectural design, comparables 7, 8 and 9 have been included in this report to demonstrate market relationship between homes with a log design and more conventinal homes with a rustic design . Comparable 7 is a log home very similar in size to the subject and with a similar, wooded 4 acre parcel. Comparables 8 and 9 are conventional homes similar in GLA to comp 7. These sales are from the 1998-1999 marketing period. Marketing time during this period was signficantly longer due to a general recession which was occuring during that time. Fort Bragg was especially hard hit due to the closing of the Georgia-Pacific wood products plant, the major employer in the area. The above data supports the appraisers opinion that subject log design does not signficiantly affect pricing but marketing time may be slightly longer than for homes more typical to the market.

 

[Don Clark]

Log Homes...Rare as Hens Teeth here

Had the same problem a few years ago. The "Log Home" actually was only a traditional home with a log veneer. However, the underwriter wanted log home comps. We had given the lender 6 comps that were similar in every respect except they did not have a log veneer. I even got M & S's book on log homes and quoted from the book about log veneer. What finally satisfied the lender? I went to a log home dealer who gave me a list of log homes they had sold, their addresses throughout the state, and what they sold for. Then they were satisfied even tho there were non locally. Might work if you try it

 

[Ray Miller]

Common to our area. Lots of full logs, and logs just about any way you want them. Started as logs ended up stick built. Started as stick built ended up part log.

This is not a problem in our area. However with that said, sales show that marketing times are longer for log type homes.

 

[VolcanoLvr]

Greg............

Nicely written subject description!

Hope others will take note.

Dave