Kitchen in the basement - illegal or not?

[AlwaysLearning]

I typically include: the 2nd kitchen is not illegal, the unit is additional living space for related family members and is not a legal apartment for rental.

An additional kitchen would be legal if clearly accessory and not intended to serve additional household

An additional living space for related family (for rental or not) would be considered an additional household and as such it would be considered illegal.

There is no such thing (in the City of Chicago) as a legal “related living” (aka an “in law”) unit.

17-17-0248 Dwelling Unit. One or more rooms arranged, designed or used as independent living quarters for a single household. Buildings with more than one kitchen or more than one set of cooking facilities are deemed to contain multiple dwelling units unless the additional cooking facilities are clearly accessory and not intended to serve additional households.

The explosion of related living/in-law units in some of the neighborhoods in late 1980s and 1990s was the reason for the city to introduce the Certificate of Zoning Compliance in (approx.) 1998.

 

[DTB]

An additional kitchen would be legal if clearly accessory and not intended to serve additional household

An additional living space for related family (for rental or not) would be considered an additional household and as such it would be considered illegal.

There is no such thing (in the City of Chicago) as a legal “related living” (aka an “in law”) unit.


The explosion of related living/in-law units in some of the neighborhoods in late 1980s and 1990s was the reason for the city to introduce the Certificate of Zoning Compliance in (approx.) 1998.

Note I didn't reference an additional dwelling unit. A finished basement connected to the above grade unit, with or without a 2nd kitchen, is not an accessory unit. Is it?

 

[AnonApprsr]

I'm not a building inspector. Maybe it's just "unrecognized by the town."

 

[Webbed Feet]

Proper research and reporting. Yeah. why bother?

Note I didn't reference an additional dwelling unit. A finished basement connected to the above grade unit, with or without a 2nd kitchen, is not an accessory unit. Is it?

Well, that is just precisely the question, IF there IS a 2nd kitchen, now isn't it? And, no appraiser should be defining the answer. The jurisdictional authority (J.A.) defines the answer to such a question. The trail to finding the correct answer is one of zoning, permits, fire codes, and any other regulations regarding occupancy. Appraisers should not be inferring that they can answer these things with boilerplate.

Especially, if the place burns down due to a second kitchen that has been not installed under the good graces of the J.A., and a lender finds out their security just went up in smoke because the hazard insurance carrier didn't give one little wit about some appraiser's boilerplate and declared the fire insurance coverage invalid. In such a case, some appraisers may end up with some splaining to do for not having properly researched and reported the matter. Again, especially, as we are definitely well into the days and times of (wink, wink, wink) "Don't worry about it. We'll just sue you later if we need to."

P.S. Appraisers had better start seriously considering CB4 in these situations for an EA the property owner can prove they have complied with what they were supposed to have complied with, instead of just "assuming" the matter is NOT illegal or not wanting to do the research needed.

 

[DTB]

The trail to finding the correct answer is one of zoning, permits, fire codes, and any other regulations regarding occupancy. Appraisers should not be inferring that they can answer these things with boilerplate. This trail very twisty and follows a dark and murky path in Chicago.


P.S. Appraisers had better start seriously considering CB4 in these situations for an EA the property owner can prove they have complied with what they were supposed to have complied with, Good point!instead of just "assuming" the matter is NOT illegal or not wanting to do the research needed. It is not a matter of not wanting to do the research, it is the lack of clarity in the great City of Chicago.

I will go on record right here, right now and offer $100.00 to anyone who can provide a verifiable source on the legality/illegality of (yes cash, it is Chicago) 2nd kitchens in Chicago. Not accessory units, but 2nd kitchens.

This source can be in writing, on the web or even a verifiable inspector who will be so bold as to make a declarative statement.

 

[Webbed Feet]

I will go on record right here, right now and offer $100.00 to anyone who can provide a verifiable source on the legality/illegality of (yes cash, it is Chicago) 2nd kitchens in Chicago. Not accessory units, but 2nd kitchens.

This source can be in writing, on the web or even a verifiable inspector who will be so bold as to make a declarative statement.

To dare to quote myself:

<....snip....> And, no appraiser should be defining the answer. The jurisdictional authority (J.A.) defines the answer to such a question. <...snip....>

Often "Research" is getting the answer(s) from the source. Appraisers do not have to attempt to interpret zoning, regulations, or codes. They just should know who to ask.

P.S. By the way, this answer should win the $100 ...

 

[DTB]

To dare to quote myself:



Often "Research" is getting the answer(s) from the source. Appraisers do not have to attempt to interpret zoning, regulations, or codes. They just should know who to ask.

P.S. By the way, this answer should win the $100 ...

While your answer may be worth $100, it is Holiday Season!, it is not the answer to my question.

To those out of towners, do you think Chicago appraisers do not have the resources of zoning, permits etc? We do, but the Chicago Way always dictates enough ambiguity to make things work.

Here's a link http://www.cityofchicago.org/city/en/depts/bldgs/provdrs/stand_plan/svcs/building_permit_status.html

Check for permits on 3124 W. Wilson, they were pulled back in 2008, I believe. You'd never know via this official link.

Imagine what you'd find about a basement finished in 1972.

The offer is still open. :new_smile-l:

 

[AlwaysLearning]

if you need old building permits (older than 18 months)

http://www.cityofchicago.org/city/en...ldgs_foia.html

 

[AlwaysLearning]

The 2nd kitchen (in a single family home) issue is somewhat of a grey area in the City of Chicago. This is due to the fact that such additional kitchens are associated with “in-law” units which the city considers to be illegal. It's no secret that the city is bias towards such additional kitchens, however to say that they are illegal is also incorrect.

CHICAGO ZONING ORDINANCE, 17-17-0248
“Dwelling Unit. One or more rooms arranged, designed or used as independent living quarters for a single household. Buildings with more than one kitchen or more than one set of cooking facilities are deemed to contain multiple dwelling units unless the additional cooking facilities are clearly accessory and not intended to serve additional households.”

e.g. a building with 2 kitchens is deemed to contain 2-units. However, if the 2nd kitchen is clearly accessory and not intended to serve additional household then the building is a one dwelling (single family) property with 2 kitchens.

Undeniably, the difficulty here may be the interpretation of what is “…clearly accessory and not intended to serve additional household…”

 

[TC]

Whatever happened to common sense, seems to be lost on this board.

Pretty easy to determine if it's a 2 unit dwelling or a home with a kitchen in the basement. In my market, as PP stated, Eye-Talian basement kitchens are everywhere. Kosher as well.

I inspected an upscale 600K home the other day. In the basement, a full granite topped, you name it high end kitchen. Need I say what the nationality was?