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New Home Builder Upgrade Adjustments

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I agree, if a model home of same/similar size had reason to be adjusted for, apart from sf, then appraiser should do it...higher ceilings . better layout etc...which is the question I asked the OP why he thought for comp 1 and 2 there was a difference of 20k among the 2 models ( he did not respond..yet ). I should have written I adjust only for sf when there is not much difference between 2 model home types.
 
In this region most of those upgrade packages become invisible in the resale market 4 or 5 years later. The new home buyers ARE paying that much extra for them, though; so it would be wrong to just blow them off. My pet peeve with developers is when they sell lot premiums based on views that they know only exist right now because they haven't yet built out the parcels that lie in the view corridor and which they also control. I hate that because I can see what's going happen to these buyers in a couple years, but in the meantime they are making their decisions that way so "The power of data compels me. The power of data compels me. The power of data compels me."
 
In this region most of those upgrade packages become invisible in the resale market 4 or 5 years later. The new home buyers ARE paying that much extra for them, though; so it would be wrong to just blow them off. My pet peeve with developers is when they sell lot premiums based on views that they know only exist right now because they haven't yet built out the parcels that lie in the view corridor and which they also control. I hate that because I can see what's going happen to these buyers in a couple years, but in the meantime they are making their decisions that way so "The power of data compels me. The power of data compels me. The power of data compels me."

That's the conundrum of the MV definition...it says a well informed or well advised buyer...do you think if a buyer was advised at purchase the lot premium they are paying 40k for will only be worth 5k on resale they would agree to the 40k?

I think a lot of problems with appraisal comes from a fuzzy /not clear explanation of what well informed or well advised is supposed to mean and how to thus apply it...
 
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In this region most of those upgrade packages become invisible in the resale market 4 or 5 years later. The new home buyers ARE paying that much extra for them, though; so it would be wrong to just blow them off. My pet peeve with developers is when they sell lot premiums based on views that they know only exist right now because they haven't yet built out the parcels that lie in the view corridor and which they also control. I hate that because I can see what's going happen to these buyers in a couple years, but in the meantime they are making their decisions that way so "The power of data compels me. The power of data compels me. The power of data compels me."

Agreed on that. Even the extra 5k lot premium for a 8000 sf lot instead of 6500 sf is staggering to me that people pay for it. That disappears instantly. I always advice friends/family on new builds to buy the most basic home possible and do whatever upgrades you want after the fact.

Compounding the appraisal problems more in regards to upgrades with new construction is that now, at least here, the tract home builders(with KB Homes being the only cheap holdout) have made granite kitchen counters, SS appliances and tile in the wet areas standard fare. No more laminate counters, white appliances or vinyl tack down flooring like they gave as standard before the bust...The stuff that matters to buyers is included in the base price. The upgrades they are piling on top of the kitchen and/or bath counters are really just silly stuff that the builder charges ridiculous prices for. Once they hit the resale market the big ticket items are really the only upgrades that carry over in the markets eyes, the rest is dust in the wind that the future buyers wont even notice or think is an upgrade.
 
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Here is my problem with it. - We are appraising current value- what the buyers are willing to pay. Options/upgrades buyers are including them and paying a premium for them- they pay dollar for dollar for these upgrades and we are given an accounting of the upgrades, most offer for the subject and the comps. We have that info-- its not like a resale where we dont have an accounting for the difference in carpet levels, tile groups, granite upgrades, ect. ect. We are given that data with a new home in many cases. So how do you justify not adjusting dollar for dollar? The adjustments are supported by the buyers themselves in the upgrades/options they choose. In the scenario that I gave to start the thread-, I had changed the values, sf ect. ect.

Actual values are the following (all single store 3 car garage) - subject base price 136.34 sf. ; model A -$134.47 sf; model A(+) - $143.84 sf. Model B. $139.91; Model B(+) $156.33. - So there is a significant difference between models, especially if the subject base price is one of the lower range base price.-- How do you justify using the more expensive model - without making some kind of adjustment for the difference? I understand as a resale comp that this difference will be hard to prove and support. But when we are given the data which supports the price difference. How do so many appraisers justify using the higher sf comps to make value fo the lower prices model? Its easy to complete an appraisal by just using the higher priced comps and everyone is HAPPY. HAPPY,HAPPY- - The AMC, THE LOAN OFFICER, THE LENDER, THE SALES AGENT and THE BUILDER. - The buyer is happy because they got into the house on time, but nobody explains that he just paid over market for the house.

As a Realtor and Appraiser I know that many realtor and buyers/sellers have no idea how to properly price/value a property. When the appraiser just hits the number to make the deal work- does the buyer realize that he is buying at the top 5% of the market? That the appraiser used the only 2-3 comps out of 20-30 that would make the deal go through? No, does the agent understand or relay to the buyer that information. - Most likely not. By just making the deal work ( hitting the number) as appraisers I think we take away the buyers opportunity to negotioate to a realistic value. Years ago, some of you may remember the market took a turn for the worse. Since things were slow I had the opportunity to take assignments that required posting notices on doors of homes being foreclosed, I talked with some of those loosing there homes- and I don't buy into the idea that all those who lost their homes didn't know what was up, but in many case it wasn't 50-100k that caused them to loose their home. 5-10,15k made the difference.
 
We are appraising current value- what the buyers are willing to pay.

Please cite source for this definition of "market value" especially the part about what buyers are willing to pay.
 
[QUOTE="Gweedo, post: 2842752, member: 152253"

By just making the deal work ( hitting the number) as appraisers I think we take away the buyers opportunity to negotioate to a realistic value. [/QUOTE]

The buyer and buyers agent should do their due diligence from the get go. The buyer is not our client. This may sound harsh, but for liability reasons we should never promote ourselves as serving third parties. No, we should not rubber stamp contract prices, but we should also never let third parties think we are serving them as well.
 
Here is my problem with it. - We are appraising current value- what the buyers are willing to pay. Options/upgrades buyers are including them and paying a premium for them- they pay dollar for dollar for these upgrades and we are given an accounting of the upgrades, most offer for the subject and the comps. We have that info-- its not like a resale where we dont have an accounting for the difference in carpet levels, tile groups, granite upgrades, ect. ect. We are given that data with a new home in many cases. So how do you justify not adjusting dollar for dollar? The adjustments are supported by the buyers themselves in the upgrades/options they choose. In the scenario that I gave to start the thread-, I had changed the values, sf ect. ect.

Actual values are the following (all single store 3 car garage) - subject base price 136.34 sf. ; model A -$134.47 sf; model A(+) - $143.84 sf. Model B. $139.91; Model B(+) $156.33. - So there is a significant difference between models, especially if the subject base price is one of the lower range base price.-- How do you justify using the more expensive model - without making some kind of adjustment for the difference? I understand as a resale comp that this difference will be hard to prove and support. But when we are given the data which supports the price difference. How do so many appraisers justify using the higher sf comps to make value fo the lower prices model? Its easy to complete an appraisal by just using the higher priced comps and everyone is HAPPY. HAPPY,HAPPY- - The AMC, THE LOAN OFFICER, THE LENDER, THE SALES AGENT and THE BUILDER. - The buyer is happy because they got into the house on time, but nobody explains that he just paid over market for the house.

As a Realtor and Appraiser I know that many realtor and buyers/sellers have no idea how to properly price/value a property. When the appraiser just hits the number to make the deal work- does the buyer realize that he is buying at the top 5% of the market? That the appraiser used the only 2-3 comps out of 20-30 that would make the deal go through? No, does the agent understand or relay to the buyer that information. - Most likely not. By just making the deal work ( hitting the number) as appraisers I think we take away the buyers opportunity to negotioate to a realistic value. Years ago, some of you may remember the market took a turn for the worse. Since things were slow I had the opportunity to take assignments that required posting notices on doors of homes being foreclosed, I talked with some of those loosing there homes- and I don't buy into the idea that all those who lost their homes didn't know what was up, but in many case it wasn't 50-100k that caused them to loose their home. 5-10,15k made the difference.

Not familiar with your area; ( my Bold) it would appear you have some information to work with noted. I would assume that is not the Only sub division, do you have others by different builders ??
spread your research miles and get other input. The answer you seek is the appraisal problem, can't do it from here.
Good Luck
 
By just making the deal work ( hitting the number) as appraisers I think we take away the buyers opportunity to negotioate to a realistic value.

The buyer and buyers agent should do their due diligence from the get go. The buyer is not our client. This may sound harsh, but for liability reasons we should never promote ourselves as serving third parties. No, we should not rubber stamp contract prices, but we should also never let third parties think we are serving them as well.
Worth repeating :clapping: They are market participants and making market decisions, to which we are to consider. Any agent that instructs their client to over pay and pray that the appraiser comes in low to use as a bargaining chip should be fined and have their license suspended. Indefinitely if they're a repeat offender.
 
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The buyer and buyers agent should do their due diligence from the get go. The buyer is not our client. This may sound harsh, but for liability reasons we should never promote ourselves as serving third parties. No, we should not rubber stamp contract prices, but we should also never let third parties think we are serving them as well.
Worth repeating :clapping: They are market participants and making market decisions, to which we are to consider. Any agent that instructs their client to over pay and pray that the appraiser comes in low to use as a bargaining chip should be fined and have their license suspended. Indefinitely if they're a repeat offender.[/QUOTE]

But that is not realistic. An agent is not responsible for instructing a client to "over pay", however an appraiser is responsible for over valuing a property. Most agents believe their own hype. If challenged, they will never admit, even to themselves the buyer "over paid". They just say things like the market was so hot, or the buyer fell in love with the house, etc..

When someone posts a concern about a buyer, I don't think they literally mean the buyer is our client. They are stating the the fact that an appraisal will impact a buyer, even though the buyer is not our named client or intended user.

In a similar vein, appraisals, one transaction at a time, an appraisal will impact markets, since each closed sale of a subject can become a new comp used in the next appraisal, AVM ,evaluation or BPO. I think it is the impact on markets where the term "public trust" comes into play.
 
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