OPEIU meets with Fannie Mae

[Jim McGrath]

Stephen, et al:

I have been told by someone that I consider knowledgeable in the appraisal field, that a union such as AGA cannot represent appraisers (federal law) because we are business owners and not employees. They can meet with Fannie & Freddie because they are trying to protect their members pension fund & not necessarily representing appraisers directly. If they are indeed successful, it seems their actions would benefit all appraisers. While it seems apparent that AGA is doing more for appraisers than any other organization, I would like to know if anyone else has heard this take on an AGA/appraiser relationship. I'm giving serious consideration to joining AGA because they seem to have the most clout to help appraisers even if their help is somewhat indirect. Any and all comments would be helpful to us all.

Larry, I would rather have someone knowledgable in Federal Law giving me information on my business, than another appraiser. What is the National Association of Manufacturers (NAM) but a business union. There is a Doctors Union now, other than the AMA, and they have gone out on strike in some areas. And there are more instances of businessmen and women belonging to unions.

The real clout of unions come from their strength of numbers, and contributions to politicians. Think of how many appraisals there would be if all union members asked for the union label on their appraisals, like they used to do on all things they bought. It would put a big crimp in the AVM process.

Jim

 

[Anonymous]

Larry,
The first unions were guilds, just like the AGA. Tradesmen like the local blacksmith, got together to set standards and prices for their labor.
Today many small business owners are union members, the one most overlooked is the barber's union Did you ever try to get a haircut on a Wednsday? The barber's union decided that they would take Wednsdays off since they work on Saturday.

We aren't employees and for the most part do not collectively bargain for wages but our union can set standards for us and protect the fees that we earn. The union is evolving just as business and government are. BTW the Models Guild is having sucess in this area negotiating with art schools for pay and working conditions for its members who are independant contractors.

 

[David C. Johnson]

<span style='color:darkblue'>Steven Santora,

Would you mind very clearly explaining what your concern is?

Do you believe the AGA is a bad idea? If so why?

Do you advise appraisers not to join the AGA? Why?

What is your recommendation to appraisers across the nation?

In this country, we have seen and lived with personal vendettas carried to the extreme of completely sacrificing the good of all. Nothing new at all. There use to be duels in the early years conducted for the sake of one's perceived "honor." The personally offended would willingly deprive the entire country of an important leader by putting a bullet in his chest because that leader might not have adequately apologized for a perceived slight. Is something similar going on here?

Regards,

David C. Johnson
appraisco@aol.com</span>

 

[Fred]

David,
You got all of that out of my one sentnece?

 

[Residential Appraisal Ser]

Dave & Forum

I know that this will provoke a nasty response from Steve. The fact is that Steve has attack me since I and others asked questions about NAIFA finances in the late 90s. He equated my questioning NAIFA finances and methods as a union takeover rather then as a member and officer of NAIFA asking probing questions.

That was the line and since that time his anti union stance has come out whenever he has the oppourtunity to attack me.

I have concluded that Steve feels important sitting on his island pontificating and doing nothing better then commenting on what other people try to do, and doing nothing himself.
I think that Steve is a smart guy and wish that he would see past his hate for me or the Guild and do something postive for a change. Attacking me won't change the Guilds direction of working to level the playing field so that the appraisers can be in charge of their own profession.


William Sentner
President
American Guild of Appraisers OPEIU AFL-CIO
RESASINC@aol.com

 

[Fred]

Bill,
Don’t lie. I never had a problem with your questions about NAIFA finances. In fact, I have asked a lot more of them than you ever did…and since I have the financial statements going back 18 years, I ask better questions, too. I am also, “just asking questions” about “finances” now, about AGA finances. I was wondering how many members the AGA has. I was also asking why your year-old promise to move AFL-CIO pension funds (finances), copied and pasted in my earlier post, has not been fulfilled.

You may with to think I am “doing nothing,” but occasionally I do. I was very involved in organizing and lobbying the votes against you and your AGA zealots who the NAIFA has dis-elected with perfect precision for two straight years. Yes, Bill. The lowly and insignificant Steve Santora and few other loyal NAIFA members put together a coalition that whipped the AGA, the self-proclaimed political juggernaut, in a political fight.

I don’t hate you. The attempted “hostile takeover” of NAIFA was your job. You just didn’t accomplish your goal. If your “crew” won the elections instead of mine then it would have been me that quit instead of you. Either way, no hard feeling on this end. I am not a sore winner.

Besides, Bill, there is no need to change subjects and talk boring things, like me. There are important issues at hand; like whether your promises to force Fannie and Freddie buy appraisals they don’t want and get the FRT de minimis to zero are realistic, feasible goals or whether you are selling snake oil. You know – “just asking questions about…finances.”

 

[Fred]

David,
I feel ready to address some of the issues that you raised. I suppose experience with the AGA is in some ways like your experience with the NCAB. I keep trying to shine the light of truth and they keep running. David, how many members does the AGA have and why are their names kept secret?

You have catalogued “evolving” stories. How’s this one going?

A year ago, supposedly Freddie Mac was about to fold under the weight of the mighty AGA:
“Our President Mike Goodwin of OPEIU wrote a letter to the Chairman of Freddie (see Valuation Mag last issue) that AFL-CIO will not stand by and watch the lending process happen without an appraisal. If this continues to happen they will make plans to pull their investment out of the Maes. (this is considerable 3/4 of a TRILLION DOLLARS. And the beat goes on. If they think that we are bluffing, we aren't.”
Bill Sentner, Appraisers Forum, July 19, 2001

Then, there was a deadline when the “Maes” would start crumbling (next week):
“AFL-CIO has about 3/4 Trillion in pension funds in the Maes. They are now worried about the effect that poor lending habits without appraisals will have on the pension funds. You will see the results of the meetings over the next 6 to 8 months.”
Bill Sentner in the Appraisal Buzz, 11/19/01

Now, it’s Fannie, not Freddie under the gun, but Steve Vertin’s post indicates only that Fannie has agreed to take a meeting. What happened to the July 19 visible results deadline promised in Novemeber.

And then there is the perennial claim::
“We are and have been working on the following issues:
On the federal level: Zero deminimus.”
Bill Sentner in the Appraisal Buzz, 11/19/01

I hope this helps, David.

Steven Santora,
AGA-Watch

 

[Jim McGrath]

David,
I feel ready to address some of the issues that you raised. I suppose experience with the AGA is in some ways like your experience with the NCAB. I keep trying to shine the light of truth and they keep running. David, how many members does the AGA have and why are their names kept secret?

You have catalogued “evolving” stories. How’s this one going?

A year ago, supposedly Freddie Mac was about to fold under the weight of the mighty AGA:
“Our President Mike Goodwin of OPEIU wrote a letter to the Chairman of Freddie (see Valuation Mag last issue) that AFL-CIO will not stand by and watch the lending process happen without an appraisal. If this continues to happen they will make plans to pull their investment out of the Maes. (this is considerable 3/4 of a TRILLION DOLLARS. And the beat goes on. If they think that we are bluffing, we aren't.”
Bill Sentner, Appraisers Forum, July 19, 2001

Then, there was a deadline when the “Maes” would start crumbling (next week):
“AFL-CIO has about 3/4 Trillion in pension funds in the Maes. They are now worried about the effect that poor lending habits without appraisals will have on the pension funds. You will see the results of the meetings over the next 6 to 8 months.”
Bill Sentner in the Appraisal Buzz, 11/19/01

Now, it’s Fannie, not Freddie under the gun, but Steve Vertin’s post indicates only that Fannie has agreed to take a meeting. What happened to the July 19 visible results deadline promised in Novemeber.

And then there is the perennial claim::
“We are and have been working on the following issues:
On the federal level: Zero deminimus.”
Bill Sentner in the Appraisal Buzz, 11/19/01

I hope this helps, David.

Steven Santora,
AGA-Watch

Steve, you have been waging your personal feud with Bill Sentner for several years on this forum. This is not the place for a personal battle. Your questions about membership, etc are questions no organization wants to answer, that is personal information. Why do you feel the need to know, or does it just give you a chance to complain? What's the next question, how much money does it have in the checking account?

I for one, am tired of hearing your complaints, and I am not a member of the Guild.

Jim McGrath

 

[Fred]

Jim,
If my posts do not entertain you, well… that’s what comes with the price of admission.

The professional appraisal organization makes no secrets about their membership numbers, so I have no idea why you think this is “personal.” I have checked with the organizations from time to time and have always been given the total, and sometimes even breakdowns by designation or breakdown by discipline that I didn’t even ask for.

I have no personal feud with Bill or anyone, no matter how many pro-union voices insinuate otherwise. My comments go to the reported pension fund threat scheme and my analysis would be the same no matter who was the President because the numbers just don’t make sense.

The amount of $750 Billion has been bandied about the forum as the amount the Union has invested in GSE’s. That is $10,000,000 for each licensed appraiser (based on 75,000 licensees to keep things round). Even if the management and transaction costs of moving that investment were only one-tenth of one percent, that is still $10,000 per licensed appraiser. Even if the plan works and every licensed appraiser joins the Union in thanks, it will take the Union (at current dues levels) 57 years to recapture the transaction costs. And that is a wildly best-case scenario.

Is it remotely possible that I am right? That this supposed scheme is too silly and financially infeasible? And this is why a year has passed since this proposal was first unveiled, but nothing has happened? How can the GSE’s not see through this?

 

[Don Clark]

8)
Stephen:

No wonder the unions liked Bill Clinton. He promised everything & delivered nothing.........just like another Bill & the union babble.

Rock on Steve. I have been to your Island. I have seen the promised land. A lot more clearier heads there than on this forum.

Don Clark, IFA