Senate Passes Housing Bill--Does it have the Dodd Bond?

[Mztk1]

There is no doubt in my mind that Licensed appraisers took the shortest path they could find to get out from under supervision. And they remained Licensed because they had no motivation to upgrade.

This is only partly true for some of us, being a Florida Licensed Appraiser I can honestly say I speak for nearly 1.5% of us!

I had my education requirements when I moved here in 1998. I had been working full time as an appraiser for 5 years at that time and had done my first appraisal in 1988 and worked as a sales agent from 1987. We decided to move to Florida and I inquired what I needed to do with the state. I complied and sent them all my information. My wife moved down in May of 1998 and I was continuing to work in NJ because my test for my Florida Certification was not until early August I believe (maybe late July). About 2 weeks before the test I found out that my IFA 30 Hr Construction course was rejected because - get this - the Florida board was of the opinion that construction knowledge was not pertinent to real estate appraising. I asked if there was a way I could get around it and they told me I can submit the couse text book and $50 for them to consider it, but I wouldn't hear back for 60 to 90 days. I didn't have that long, so I sat for the license test instead. Ever since there has been absolutely "0" practical reason to fill out a new log and sit for a new test, though I have increased the number of tested hours I have done in classrooms by about 120 hrs.

A fellow student in my last class became licensed around 2000 (his license number is in the 160s). He was told in a class with Steve Williamson (an awesome instructor who I recommend highly) that to sit for your license you need 1,000 hrs of course work. He filled out his application, sent in his log, was approved, sat for the test and passed, then a few months later his license was suspended pending a revocation hearing for filing an inadequate log. The state said he needed 2,000 hrs to be licensed. He fought it with a lawyer and a couple of instructors, and finally won the case. He was the FIRST licensed appraiser to take the test with less than 2,000 hrs of logged experience. Since the number of licenses issued in the state stopped at 249, I know for certain that ~65% of the total people who became licensed appraisers became licensed with 2,000 hrs of experience in the State of Florida. And with all the people moving here, I wouldn't doubt if a lot of them ran into the exact problem I did.

 

[Elliott]

FL will not take internet classes

So when it was slow I got my hours, even USPAP, though AI.
Oh gee, its so much better to drive 100 miles, sit on your azz for
8 hours, have to listen to really stupid questions by clueless
'business decision' appraisers, listen to the instructor telling you
what an authority he is, though you can't use him as an authority
when the state board knocks on your door.

Oh yeah, and I had to pass every hourly exam, while the 'live'
instructors makes you sign a sheet twice a day, so you can then
go outside in the hall and retrieve your office messages. And the
live instructor has 'no exam' cause he just pocketed a few $K.
Give me a break.

 

[TJSum]

Money and time. Not much of either. It is more difficult than is was before 1/1/2008. I will never understand why someone who meets the experience requirements does not get the education hours and move up to certified. The last time I had to get cont. ed I got credit for 28 hours and it took me 4.5 hours on the internet from start to finish

It is not hard.

It depends on the State, each State is different. For example, Maryland does not accept online education for upgrading. If an appraiser was an old timer, they probably were licensed with 75 hours of education. Now in order to upgrade, they need 180 hours. So an appraiser would have to take 7 classes in person at 15 hours per class 105 hours). And that is only if you still have your class certificates from many years ago when you originally got your license. If you can not find them, then you would need to take the full 180 hours, in person. Many appraisers who have been licensed since the beginning run into this problem trying to come up with school certs from 17 years ago. And of course none of the 200 hours of CE an appraiser has taken over the years would count toward the upgrade because they are a different catergory.

In DC, they have an interesting twist to their experience log (unless it has been changed). Of the total hours needed, I believe it is 500 hours mandated that must come from "complex" assignments, in other words, assignments that require a Certified license in order to do it. So the only way to complete the experience hours would be to find a Certified Appraiser to work under, many Licensee's have been on their own for ten years or more and have no desire working under someone else.

Virginia does allow online education as far as I know. Many appraisers in this region carry all three licenses DC, MD and VA. But because of each State having different requirements, there are plenty of appraisers holding different levels of licensing for each State.

In all three of these States, the Licensee level is the largest catergory, it is not looked down upon as those from some other states, like Florida or Pennsylvania. In this region, the Licensee level is just looked at as someone who wishes to specialize in low end to mid-range housing. Many long time Licensees have no interest in doing high end homes, so they do not upgrade, it is not that they are any less professional or care less about their career, but rather a choice of what area they wish to specialize in. Up until this current crash, there was plenty of Licensee level work to allow one to make a good living since 1991 when licensing started in this area, so there was no pressure to upgrade.

I think our differing opinions on this matter mostly come from what State we reside in, I can see why those from Florida, Pennsylvania, etc., would hold different opinions. From a personal view, I always will judge someone by their quality of work, not what level of license or designation they hold, because work quality is the ultimate goal, some just take different paths getting there which is fine.

 

[Mztk1]

I understand it's a business decision. I generally charge $750 to $1500 for properties over 1M. We have lots of them along the coast and back bays. AMCs are even willing to pay these fees and they take about ten more minutes to complete than a typical 3/2 house.

Once again it's a business decision.

I believe you. But it is hard to fathom that FL will not take internet classes. Your instructors must be good lobbyists.

I appraise million dollar properties. My highest was about $15,000,000. But the federally related transaction amount must be less than $1,000,000. In NJ and FL, where I have appraised, the limit is placed on the transaction (mortgage) amount that is federally related. Not the actual value of the house. I can appraise a mortgage amount higher than $1,000,000 too, if the lender is not a federally secured institution.

In Florida you can do continuing education over the internet, but you cannot do the necessary tested classes that go towards original certification over the net. I hate taking internet courses anyway. I much prefer being in the class and meeting people and hearing other's opinions (even though I very rarely say a word because I am shy and bad in groups unless I am blending in).

 

[Mztk1]

FL will not take internet classes

So when it was slow I got my hours, even USPAP, though AI.
Oh gee, its so much better to drive 100 miles, sit on your azz for
8 hours, have to listen to really stupid questions by clueless
'business decision' appraisers, listen to the instructor telling you
what an authority he is, though you can't use him as an authority
when the state board knocks on your door.

Oh yeah, and I had to pass every hourly exam, while the 'live'
instructors makes you sign a sheet twice a day, so you can then
go outside in the hall and retrieve your office messages. And the
live instructor has 'no exam' cause he just pocketed a few $K.
Give me a break.

A wise man who doesn't learn from fools is a fool himself. I'm sure you learned something from the classes you sat through. I know they can be boring, but frankly, I like hearing what other appraisers are doing out there, and I have found some very good instructors here and had my favorites in NJ as well.

 

[moh malekpour]

I have heard that it takes few extra on-line appraisal or real estate courses from a private vocational school and passing a multiple answer question or true/false test from the state to upgrade a license to a certificate. Is that true? and if it is true, is it going to improve the appraiser's qualification when is upgraded from license to certificate? Do some states have a comprehensive exam like state bar or CPA exam?

 

[Mztk1]

I have heard that it takes few extra on-line appraisal or real estate courses from a private vocational school and passing a multiple answer question or true/false test from the state to upgrade a license to a certificate. Is that true? and if it is true, is it going to improve the appraiser's qualification when is upgraded from license to certificate? Do some states have a comprehensive exam like state bar or CPA exam?

Not in Florida. Only only wish it did and it would make sense. The two are so similar it is ridiculous. They should just phase out the licensed category and make all current licensed appraisers certified residential appraisers. Of course, that is coming from a licensed appraiser! I might be a little biased.

 

[JSmith43]

Anybody got a photograph of Tobias The Cat?

Make fun all you want. I'm in favor of Tobias to be grandfathered in on this one:icon_mrgreen:

 

[The Warrior Monk]

‘‘(A) be certified— ‘‘(i) by the State in which the property to be appraised is located; or ‘‘(ii) by a nationally recognized professional appraisal organization; and ‘‘(B) have demonstrated verifiable education in the appraisal requirements established by the Federal Housing Administration under this subsection.’’.​

I'm not quite sure to what to make of this. There seems to be too much wiggle room.

If it was more specific, such as "be designated by AI," that would make sense because it would mean that one has satisfied requirements higher than that required by the ASB for the CR credential. But, then again, they wouldn't be that bold so as to mention a specific org.

 

[The Warrior Monk]

In my state I cannot appraise houses with a $1,000,000 federally related transaction amount. So what!? There are no houses, or very few, that are financed by a federal institution for more than $1,000,000. I am not missing much if anything.

Many lenders that deal with such properties want the appraiser to be at least a certified in this case, regardless of whether or not the assignment is a FRT.

Also, why not specialize in this property type? The lenders that deal with the big dollars are a world away from the MBs and AMCs, and they pay a whooooole lot more than the run-of-the mill properties.