The Appraiser Shortage Myth Part 43

[TRESinc]

Denis, how can you explain that for years, TRID was not a regulation, but the same resistance to cost plus was in place?

good god, use a little common sense. if you were a lender which would you want to do - pay the AMC nothing but the fee collected from the borrower or pay the AMC $X PLUS the fee collected from the borrower?

 

[DWiley]

WOW. Once again an insulting post from a representative of an AMC, who thinks the plight of the modern appraiser is simply a perception problem. I asked you to cite an example of another industry that pools labor against itself the way AMCs do and all I (we) got is crickets. Now you want to copy my tactic without responding your self.

Point #1 - Appraisers who have worked for AMCs have chimed in on this thread, and your response to there was (if any)? Politifuddle.

Point #2 - Sure, maybe AMCs "...would love..." a cost plus model - they just love the skim/extortion model a little more, no?

Point #3 - You want to call someone out, call them out, your general attacks hit everyone.

Look DW, I am not saying things are not tough all over or suggesting any solution is easy or feasible or preferable within the current legislative landscape (don't let my debunk of your nonsense(s) allude to that). What I would like to see or hear, is a spade be called a spade. Own what you are a part of, rather than defending it with nonsense that as someone else noted, sounds a lot like what/how a politician would answer a tough question. On a later post you go on to say how the "credibility" of posters on this thread is being deteriorated by what they have said - again another insult instead of honesty from you as far as I am concerned. That's a defensive tactic from the corner instead of an offensive tactic rendered from a position of truth. You dodge around the truth, as far as I am concerned, because the truth is ugly.

Q - "Hey Don, how do you sleep at night"
A - "On a bed made of money"

Madmen Season 1

So lets really be honest, the cost plus model is not impossible, or even that tough to implement really, but it is less profitable for AMCs and the banks that hold interest in the AMCs, which is the true primary reason it is not implemented. Why work a bit harder to make less money right?

Lets be honest again, AMCs pool labor in a way that is not typical in another industry in the US, with a result that comes very close (if not hitting it on the head) to a monopoly on labor.

And lets end this with a point to the thread title, that trainees are not entering the industry because the margin that used to pay for trainees is now absorbed by the AMC, who survive from the skim, and makes more profit by a larger skim, possible by the pooling of labor.

So a cop shoots an innocent person dead. Then a member of the police force shows up at the funeral and says "Gee I sure am sorry, but it is really tough being a police officer."

You are free to believe whatever you choose to believe. All I know is that I would LOVE cost plus and I have not yet met anyone in management at an AMC who would not favor cost plus.

I am sorry if you feel that me pointing out something that is just a fact is an insult. And, I never said that there were not real problems, because there certainly are real problems. However, changing to cost plus will not solve the "fee problem" the way that some appraisers think that it will. Fees are driven by appraiser behavior in a market. Going to cost plus will not change appraiser behavior.

 

[J Grant]

good god, use a little common sense. if you were a lender which would you want to do - pay the AMC nothing but the fee collected from the borrower or pay the AMC $X PLUS the fee collected from the borrower?

I get it, read my posts. It was a rhetorical question, ( why was cost plus not in place all the years prior to TRID),.In fact your above reminding everybody of the reason shows the argument that TRID as the barrier to cost plus as false. TRID is just the latest excuse to maintain a system that provides a free of cost to the lender and a great deal of profit to the AMC.

The fact that this system survives by decimating appraiser income and driving many competent appraisers away from AMC work is only of interest to those lenders who are happy to get the good appraisers eschewing AMC work on their direct order panel , or to lenders affiliated with AMC's when they see result of an appraiser shortage ( the COW states). The rest will maintain this system as long as it can, any adverse impact to appraisers or the appraisal profession is collateral damage .

 

[J Grant]

You are free to believe whatever you choose to believe. All I know is that I would LOVE cost plus and I have not yet met anyone in management at an AMC who would not favor cost plus.

I am sorry if you feel that me pointing out something that is just a fact is an insult. And, I never said that there were not real problems, because there certainly are real problems. However, changing to cost plus will not solve the "fee problem" the way that some appraisers think that it will. Fees are driven by appraiser behavior in a market. Going to cost plus will not change appraiser behavior.

We are willing to take our chances, okay? You have our blessing to influence your company to take steps to implement the cost plus switch. Thank you.

 

[Pittsburgh Pete]

There is nothing Pavlovian about most responses to AMC issues- appraisers state the reality as they and colleagues experienced it over the years. . Appraisers can get heated since AMC gain in market share has destroyed livelihoods and adversely impacted so many.

I think what bothers appraisers is the spin put forward by DW and others with AMC interests behind their posts. Personally he sounds like a great guy to sit down and have a beer with, or talk about appraisals with. However his posts on the topic serve a purpose- has anybody wondered why a chief appraiser for a national AMC, who surely must be very busy, spends so much time on a BB board ? Though he does post ( and they are excellent)) about general appraisal topics, a great deal of his participation is in AMC related posts, and I assume that is by intention of his company to get their "alternate facts" message across.

Good Lord J Grant--you're beginning to sound like something out of the current administration.

Perhaps his purpose of responding is to dispel the half-truths and untruths that AMC haters disseminate and exaggerate.

If the response is not Pavlovian, please explain to me what it was in Mr. Wiley's post that Fcrecords found to be insulting? Good luck with that.

 

[J Grant]

You are free to believe whatever you choose to believe. All I know is that I would LOVE cost plus and I have not yet met anyone in management at an AMC who would not favor cost plus.

I am sorry if you feel that me pointing out something that is just a fact is an insult. And, I never said that there were not real problems, because there certainly are real problems. However, changing to cost plus will not solve the "fee problem" the way that some appraisers think that it will. Fees are driven by appraiser behavior in a market. Going to cost plus will not change appraiser behavior.

Regarding the above, first of all, fees are not driven ONLY by appraiser behavior in the market . Or else why would direct order lenders , private work, and VA work be paying such vastly different fees than an AMC in the same market area with the same supply of appraisers in that area? ( I know why, it is a rhetorical question.)

While cost plus can not change appraiser behavior, a shift in market conditions ( to cost plus) will change the ways appraisers compete: if a uniform fee is paid for work from an AMC in a region ( at whatever level), appraisers are no longer competing for each and every order with low fee as a component of selection.

Getting back to the spin issue, no need for the fake concern about how cost plus won't solve the fee issue/appraiser behavior as holding back from implementing cost plus. AMC's are not implementing the change out of concern for appraiser fees- they are resistant out of concern for THEIR fees .

 

[J Grant]

"Pittsburgh Pete, Perhaps his purpose of responding is to dispel the half-truths and untruths that AMC haters disseminate and exaggerate.

We are not AMC haters, we hate what the affiliation of certain lendrs and AMC's have done to the appraisal profession. What you call half truths and untruths on our the appraiser's side, is reality as we have experienced it, as many of us have been on the SL panel, as well as worked for various AMCs as well as non AMC dirct lender order work and report first hand our experience with fees, assignment conditions, and reason for selection or exclusion around rom getting work , vastly different on the AMC side vs non AMC side .

If the response is not Pavlovian, please explain to me what it was in Mr. Wiley's post that Fcrecords found to be insulting? Good luck with that

I cant' speak for that individual response but I find many of Fcreord's posts on point on the topic. Any vehemence aside, his perspective echoes the experience majority of appraisers have had- in our boots on the ground interaction and working with AMC's. -

 

[TRESinc]

The one AMC I am familiar with (a friend is the chief appraiser for the lender) bills the lender once a month, but is not paid in advance for assignments it is processing.

that's how it works with the lone AMC i accept orders from as well, and the lender dictates the minimum fee they have to pay the appraiser.

 

[gregb]

that's how it works with the lone AMC i accept orders from as well, and the lender dictates the minimum fee they have to pay the appraiser.

And it is the lender who controls more or less which appraisers the AMC uses.

 

[Terrel L. Shields]

His business model has ZERO relevance to 99.999% of boots on the ground residential appraisers chasing lender work.

In a residential market of 10 million, I would say he had a significant "boot on the ground"...What does the mode of transportation have to do with it?