USPAP 3 year disclosure question

[Mike Kennedy]

Retired back on July 1, 2001 as I recall. :new_all_coholic:

:laugh: for those who developed a keen fondness for the "good old days" (and it's in the 2010 Index)

 

[Tony V]

Only in USPAP January Q&A's as far as I know...

2010-02[FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]: ETHICS RULE – CONDUCT [/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]Disclosure of any prior services regarding the subject property, when an appraiser has performed services other than appraisal practice. [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]Question: [/FONT]
[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]If I have performed a service other than appraisal practice, such as acting as a general contractor within the prior three years, do I have to describe the specific service or merely state a service was performed? [/FONT]
[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]Response: [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]You must disclose to the client the type of prior service you performed regarding the property and this must be included in the report certification. This disclosure is not limited to services provided as part of appraisal practice. Therefore, [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]each service [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]must be disclosed to the client and appear in the certification. [/FONT]
[/FONT]

And that is the iron answer...thanks...

 

[Terrel L. Shields]

Explain to me again why some TAFFY DAFFY idiot requires the disclosure to be in your certification and why wouldn't it be better to have it in the SOW or Limiting conditions, etc. etc. There are 15 places it would be better to have it in. I am currently doing a laundry list of properties, each and every one of which I have appraised in the past 3 years...updates for a bank's portfolio.

 

[REvaluator]

Bull@^&

Bullsh*t rule, from a Bullsh*t document, written by a bunch of bullsh*tters. USPAP does absolutely nothing to instill confidence in the public it only creates positions for idiots to fill and more work for appraisers. And this rule is proof. I love that this statement MUST be in the certification...the whole GD report is signed and certified what the hell does it matter where in the report it goes.m2:

 

[Webbed Feet]

Bullsh*t rule, from a Bullsh*t document, written by a bunch of bullsh*tters. USPAP does absolutely nothing to instill confidence in the public it only creates positions for idiots to fill and more work for appraisers. And this rule is proof. I love that this statement MUST be in the certification...the whole GD report is signed and certified what the hell does it matter where in the report it goes.m2:

I think you are being a bit too literal. The USPAP thing is we must certify it. It doesn't have to be "in the certifications" all nice and tidy like

1.
2.
3.
.
.
.
.
.
57. I did something in the last three years.

One of the reasons is almost all appraisal software has the "Certifications" as preprinted pages for the 2005 Fannie forms and practically no appraisal software allows, or has a way, to place an additional certification in the preprinted areas. ClickForms is the only one I know of. Therefore, we are forced to "certify" this matter somewhere in our addendums or in a good place in the forms themselves.

 

[Webbed Feet]

This has probably already been discused elsewhere but I didn't see it.

Received an order from equifax settlement services, after I received the order I informed them I had done an appraisal on the property within the past 3 years and the said to proceed.

I placed in the report that I completed an appraisal on the subject within the past 3 years.

They are now coming back and stated that they are requiring the date of the previous appraisal (they cannot "require" that, it is none of their business and confidential.) , purpose of the previous appraisal (they cannot "require" that, it is none of their business and confidential.) and comment on the upgrades / changes to the property since the previous appraisal. (they cannot "require" that, it is none of their business and confidential.)

I am only required to state that I have completed an appraisal on the property within the past 3 years correct?

In reality, you do NOT have to say you did an appraisal. You are to identify the "type" of service ... right? .. A "type" of service can be "Appraisal Practice." I do not see a mandate that it must be specified to be any of "appraisal," "appraisal review," or "appraisal consulting."

So call your state board and see if they agree with me. A "Type" is "Appraisal Practice." That way when this crap happens, if your board agrees, you can respond back with ... "I never said I was involved with a real estate appraisal. I told you I was involved in appraisal practice and you said to proceed. No other information is due you about this and anything else would be confidential between myself and my client of that service. If not, are you suggesting that your firm does not want this service I did for you kept confidential next time this happens again with some other lender?"

 

[Don Clark]

In reality, you do NOT have to say you did an appraisal. You are to identify the "type" of service ... right? .. A "type" of service can be "Appraisal Practice." I do not see a mandate that it must be specified to be any of "appraisal," "appraisal review," or "appraisal consulting."

So call your state board and see if they agree with me. A "Type" is "Appraisal Practice." That way when this crap happens, if your board agrees, you can respond back with ... "I never said I was involved with a real estate appraisal. I told you I was involved in appraisal practice and you said to proceed. No other information is due you about this and anything else would be confidential between myself and my client of that service. If not, are you suggesting that your firm does not want this service I did for you kept confidential next time this happens again with some other lender?"

Here I go again, agreeing with the Duck:icon_mrgreen:

I would simply tell them the type of service. The rest is confiential between me and the client I did the service for, whatever that service was.

 

[Terrel L. Shields]

Don & Duck
Your entire report is not the "certification". USPAP makes it clear that the certification is a separate section within the appraisal report.
Your certification "is contained" as a separate part of the document, and the commentary under Std 2-3 explicitly says that. If you sign any PORTION of the report, your signature "must also sign this certification". Clearly the "Certification" is a separate document. It is not explicit that there can be 1, 2, or 20 certifications., but each must be signed.
USPAP is explicit about where a trainee signs. They are mum on most other similar edicts, such as disclosure of the sales history, the extent of the property inspection which is also a requirement (typically done in the SOW, but not explictly required to be there) and, thus when it explicitly says that
"an appraiser must disclose to the client and in the report certification:
ANY SERVICES regarding the subject property..."

I believe that is "dead level plane" plain... disclose in the certification anything "regarding" the subject property. I will not vet those words. If I delivered flowers for my friends Flower shop, it will be in the report CERTIFICATION...thus i beg to differ with my good friends of on the fringes of the coasts.

 

[Webbed Feet]

Don & Duck
Your entire report is not the "certification". USPAP makes it clear that the certification is a separate section within the appraisal report.
Your certification "is contained" as a separate part of the document, and the commentary under Std 2-3 explicitly says that. If you sign any PORTION of the report, your signature "must also sign this certification". Clearly the "Certification" is a separate document. It is not explicit that there can be 1, 2, or 20 certifications., but each must be signed.
USPAP is explicit about where a trainee signs. They are mum on most other similar edicts, such as disclosure of the sales history, the extent of the property inspection which is also a requirement (typically done in the SOW, but not explictly required to be there) and, thus when it explicitly says that
"an appraiser must disclose to the client and in the report certification:
ANY SERVICES regarding the subject property..."

I believe that is "dead level plane" plain... disclose in the certification anything "regarding" the subject property. I will not vet those words. If I delivered flowers for my friends Flower shop, it will be in the report CERTIFICATION...thus i beg to differ with my good friends of on the fringes of the coasts.

Interesting! In Oregon trainees are not allowed to sign appraisal reports whatsoever. Got your USPAP violation about that one handy to quote line per line? I wish you luck finding it.

So you're saying any appraiser that works as a UPS driver would have to "Disclose" every property they ever dropped off a package at huh? Me thinks you are very confused about "services" involving real estate and "services" involving people. But you can disclose any bible prayer meeting you attend, or anytime you eat dinner at a buddies place, located on any piece of real estate you want to. I certainly will never stop you.... But you're gonna need one whale sized database for it. Plus I hope you've got a really well documented social calendar for the last three years.

All of which brings up a point that this new Ethics Rule change was made retroactive back to the prior three years of our lives when absolutely none of us may have had needed documented records of every "service" we may have done 2.999999 years ago to today. Frankly, I think what has just been pulled regarding that is illegal, or should be.

Next up along with an appraisal report cannot have more than one signed certification page... or certifications all have to be on that page.. .. All prior comparable ever "considered" are now defined to be "Services" involving those properties! ... LOL.. I can't wait, this is going to be just so special !!!

 

[Don Clark]

Preprinted Certification

Terrell,

Standardized forms for mortgage financing for residential purposes, 2005 version does not allow for modification of the certification page. TAF knows that. The secondary market knows that. They also know that we must have some way to comply with USPAP. Other forms and formats for other purposes often do have certification pages that can be added to. Since we live in the real world, and unless and until a certification page is structured for the 2005 series of residential forms, I will add it to page 3 of the URAR and similar forms, or in a highlighted area of any other form where a signature is required on that form. I will call it "Additional Certification" which is allowed by USPAP( STD-2, lines 857 & 858.) I will have then complied with USPAP to the best of my ability. I do not believe that a state regulatory board or TAF would find a problem with that, in that I have done all that could be done under the circumstance.

BTW, where in USPAP does it state that there can only be 1 signed certification? And, where in USPAP does it describe where a trainee must sign? I can tell you that it does not. USPAP does not deal with licensure, trainees, and the like. Any person who engages in Appraisal Practice(Definitions, page U-1, lines 19-20:valuation services performed by an individual acting as an appraiser, ................................

Licensure is not part of USPAP.