ANSI &....

[RCA]

I've read & re-read the ANSI, still I'm unable to find a definitive answer to my question... This is the first time I've encountered this situation since being required to adhere to the ANSI standards.

From ANSI: "To be included in finished square footage calculations, finished areas must have a ceiling height of at least 7 ft. (2.13 m) except under beams, ducts, and other obstructions where the height may be 6 ft. 4 in. (1.93 m)..."

The ANSI Z765-2021 (as far as I can tell, anyway) doesn't discern a difference between above-grade & below-grade ceiling height requirements. This house has a basement area fully finished in style & quality similar to the above-grade area, with a recreation room, a bedroom, & a full bath, except... The ceiling heights in this area range from 6.6' to 6.8'. I'd imagine that the low ceiling height is due to beams, ducts, & other obstructions just above the gypsum board, but I sometimes choose to leave my imagination out of appraisal reports.

Can this below-grade area be counted as finished below-grade living area? Or, does the ceiling height relegate the below-grade area to unfinished area, thereby removing the rec room, bedroom, & bath, & likely opening a can of worms with the home owner?

Thanks!!

7' is actually a liberal minimum height. One could argue that it should be 8'6". Only the reality is that there are many ceilings that were originally 8' - and then people start adding layers of flooring over the years. Kids don't need that much height, so we get to 7'.

The point is we can regard anything below 7' - if it is only slightly below 7' - as something less desirable. So, maybe 6' -7' should be only half the value, 5'-6' one-third the value. That would make more sense --- but make the measurements and calculations impractical.

 

[Sadie]

ANSI applies to all areas of the home. The 7 foot requirement applies to below-grade finished area in the same way that it applies to above grade finished area. My inclination would be to include it in the finished area, state the height, then cite the relevant portion of ANSI, "To be included in finished square footage calculations, finished areas must have a ceiling height of at least 7 ft. (2.13 m) except under beams, ducts, and other obstructions where the height may be 6 ft. 4 in. (1.93 m)."

Its for GLA. GLA is finished area above grade by definition.

 

[RCA]

Its for GLA. GLA is finished area above grade by definition.

Correction: It is for "finished areas" - which may be above or below grade. That is ANSI Z765. You won't find the term GLA or "living area" in ANSI Z765-2021. That is a Fannie Mae term based on ANSI's definition of above grade living area. .... In fact, Fannie Mae should have replaced GLA with ANSI's definitions of above and below grade finished area. But, well, they couldn't deal with the problem. Not clever enough and they are always a bit lazy - which I am sure they would blame on the inadequacies of the appraisal profession - which we blame on them and so on.

 

[shrubberyvaluation]

Its for GLA. GLA is finished area above grade by definition.

source?

 

[Overimprovement]

Yet another ANSI fail. When seasoned appraisers are still arguing over details of how to interpret the two page document, that is a big problem!
The GSE's, AI, and TAF should demand that changes be made to make it crystal clear in all circumstances. Surely they have enough data by now (just read the threads on this site) to know what clarity is needed.

They want to march to the beat of a different drummer but don't even have drumsticks yet.

 

[Fernando]

Yet another ANSI fail. When seasoned appraisers are still arguing over details of how to interpret the two page document, that is a big problem!
The GSE's, AI, and TAF should demand that changes be made to make it crystal clear in all circumstances. Surely they have enough data by now (just read the threads on this site) to know what clarity is needed.

They want to march to the beat of a different drummer but don't even have drumsticks yet.

Fernando has been criticizing Fannie's use of ANSI. It's confusing and unclear and Fannie is restricting how Appraiser's local way in calling the square footage.
I expected Fannie to come out with a revision/update in clarifying their interpretation of ANSI but none has occurred.
Makes me wonder if Fannie is aware that most appraisers are not using ANSI correctly as Fannie intended.

 

[CGinMN]

In this case it is not a failure of ANSI, but a failure of appraisers not reading.

 

[Dublin ohio]

In this case it is not a failure of ANSI, but a failure of appraisers not reading.

You beat me to it. It is obviously true. The vast majority of the questions I have seen on this forum. Can easily be answered by reading the Fannie Q & A on ANSI.

 

[Fernando]

If appraisers can not clearly see what Fannie wants from ANSI, it's a failure of Fannie.
Fernando always believes in clarity and conciseness in appraisal reports.

 

[Dublin ohio]

If appraisers can not clearly see what Fannie wants from ANSI, it's a failure of Fannie.

Did you tell you teachers in school the same thing when you did not understand what they were saying?