How do you guys normally measure a stair-like this?

[Zoe]

well, if we take out the stairs. then should we not take out some interior wall since that space cannot be used. so the 1st level interior walls have no GLA use?
i've left plain GLA reality, and now entered i'm a better anal measurer than you.

FNMA is trying to make a standard. That is the important part. It actually is bonus to appraisers in my mind. They have not done tons of good for appraisers. This is good move for both parties.

 

[Zoe]

Remember many states already require ANSI. I did not know that.

 

[Zoe]

If you want a different standard, that's fine with me. But the standard is the important part.

 

[RCA]

well, if we take out the stairs. then should we not take out some interior wall since that space cannot be used. so the 1st level interior walls have no GLA use?
i've left plain GLA reality, and now entered i'm a better anal measurer than you.

Walls are OK, as I see it. Thicker walls mean more insulation for heat and sound and thus impact livability. Also thicker walls do allow for more room for piping and other conduits. But, if they are too thick, it becomes the same issue as with ill-designed traffic conduits like stairs and hallways. When walls get really thick - they are often called "hidden walls" or more appropriately "dead space", aka "utility space." These should not be included in the living area per ANSI. Thus you will run into this problem of trying to identify dead space - which often can only be done indirectly when the length of the interior room widths plus standard wall width doesn't add up to the interior distance between exterior walls on opposites of the house ( and this is where you need a genuine CAD program like Home Designer Pro or Chief Architect. Double walls are the most common form of this menace. Sometimes there is a good reason for these, of course.

In 100+ year old homes, like old Victorian triplexes in San Francisco, they are common.

1. Let me suggest: Commercial buildings are usually well-designed because they have to be. Not always though. Sometimes "architectural grandeur" gets in the way. On the other hand, the architects work with engineers in large expensive commercial buildings and open multi-story hallways and hubs are usually intelligently heated and ventilated. That doesn't mean though that a well designed residential building has to look like a commercial building.

2. Elevators!! Another traffic conduit, - are a very smart move. You can have an elevator carry people and equipment up and down several stories without causing a heating or ventilation problem.

3. So, I have seen for example, a 5 floor 2.5 story split level, with stairs located back and forth between different sides or parts of the house, with the smallest possible openings (that none the less were very very elegant high quality Brazilian cherry with single wrought iron rails, - together with a small elevator that went from the bottom floor to the top garage (it is on the side of a hill), that was super cool and smart. Husband and wife Stanford engineering graduates.

 

[RCA]

The standard uses the word "however" which is used to contrasts with or seems to contradict something that has been said previously.

Ok, you are correct, there is a contradiction. However, any reasonable person applying the standard understands its application and when applied the same every time will produce the same results.

"However" relates to the statement: "Openings to the floor below cannot be included in the square footage calculation." It has nothing to do with the contradiction between 3.5 and 3.6, in relation to whether the area of the stairs from the main floor to the basement should be considered as part of the above grade or below grade living area.

The stairs are below grade. That is simply a fact. There really is no compelling reason to put them in the above grade living area. Can you think of a logical reason, other than someone thinks it is more convenient?

But far better would be to simply put all stair, hallway, traffic hub and elevator area into a separate category called something like "traffic area", - except you have to add to the standard rules for deciding whether a given square foot of building area should be considered part of some traffic conduit or living area. That could be done. But I wouldn't trust the people currently making the decisions for the ANSI standard to succeed. They are not that smart. [ You would have to be ruthless with hallways - where people often de facto like to put closets, cubboards and furniture, especially in small homes where space is precious. One can argue, successfully, that hallways are not places for closets and cupboards - better to create a separate storage area off to the side, - just as you might see in a hotel. ]

 

[andrew81]

 

[Fernando]

If ANSI becomes standard and doesn't match with assessors or 3rd party sources then we can't compare subject's area correctly with comps.
Best let Fernando do his measurements to compare apples with apples.

 

[Tim The Enchanter]

One nice thing about drivebys is this stuff is a non issue.

 

[mp2277]

You need a curved tape measure

 

[mp2277]

Trust me, in that home, the roughly 80 sf of stairs is insignificant to its total value. There are plenty of other value related aspects to concern with. Also spend some time with ANSI as had been mentioned.

There are more than 80 sf of stairs there, but i would never know because I would never measure them