This Won't end Well for Germany

[glenn walker]

If we just roll over and let our allies be invaded by our adversaries pretty soon we won't have any allies & the world will be filled with adversaries. This may not be the time or place to try and halt Russian aggression however after the multigenerational investment we have made into European security we had better be poking our noses into their business to keep them all inside their own borders.

We have not one single war since WW-11 and we have proven time and time again this small forces are ineffective but as the World gets more and more angry it only takes a spark to get things going. Imagine if Russia sent troops to Canada or Mexico--Also NATO has 1,000 to 5,000 men they can send in and they dont need Americans.

 

[glenn walker]

Nancy Pelosi to Putin I am going to choke you unless you immediately listen to my commands.

 

[Charles West]

It's all good. Let Europe suffer the consequences of their actions and we can do likewise. There was a time when we needed to pull Europe's bacon out of the fire but I think that time has passed.

 

[glenn walker]

It's all good. Let Europe suffer the consequences of their actions and we can do likewise. There was a time when we needed to pull Europe's bacon out of the fire but I think that time has passed.

Joe learned nothing from his Afghanistan pull out and the Country right now is in no mood for any more police actions or small 1,000 to 5,000 troop insurgent type operations. As Covid-19 -inflation -supply chains- high gas and oil prices he needs to get focused on America First --he thinks his poll numbers are bad now wait until they unloading a cargo plane showing dead American Soldiers Flag Draped caskets. Ukraine is not a member of NATO and Putin knows we are trying to use Ukraine as a potential place for us to install missiles aimed at Russia.

 

[Mike Ault]

Joe learned nothing from his Afghanistan pull out and the Country right now is in no mood for any more police actions or small 1,000 to 5,000 troop insurgent type operations. As Covid-19 -inflation -supply chains- high gas and oil prices he needs to get focused on America First --he thinks his poll numbers are bad now wait until they unloading a cargo plane showing dead American Soldiers Flag Draped caskets. Ukraine is not a member of NATO and Putin knows we are trying to use Ukraine as a potential place for us to install missiles aimed at Russia.

We don't need our military deployed beyond our borders for any reason other than to deter aggression and enforce international rule of law. If we are going to stand idly by while Russian troops redraw the borders of Europe then we might as well bring them all home because you are right, we have been totally emasculated. I don't believe Vladimir Putin has any legitimate security concerns regarding NATO expansion, he just looks in the mirror every morning and sees Peter the Great staring back at him.

 

[IlliniApp]

Do you think human rights were mentioned once during this meeting?
View attachment 58635

More like "can you pass me the Geritol and the Cialus?"

 

[Big ole Boy]

The Russians long history with the Scythians is a sphere of influence with a common language (Russian) ..... NATO has been sticking its nose too far under Ukraines skirt for far too long. Russia has no interest in a puny piece of Ukraine - they just want their rightful buffer of respect/sphere of influence. Leave Ukraine alone and Russia will leave Ukraine alone.

 

[IlliniApp]

That sounds like an emasculated point of view. We better grow our package back because there are evil forces afoot in the world and we are humanity's best hope for advancing the cause of freedom believe it or not. And we don't have to do that alone. Chanting "America First!" when we discuss foreign policy infinitely weakens our position however.

But it is satisfying!

 

[Peter LeQuire]

The Soviet Union (Russia after the czars) agreed to stand by while Germany conquered all of Western Europe. When Germany turned on the Soviets/Russia, it ran into the same problems Napoleon did. As Germany ran out of gas, material and men, Russia filled the power vacuum and occupied Europe (including most of Germany) from the Balkans to the Baltic. It looks to me as if Germany and most of Europe have gotten so eco-friendly they've lost the ability to defend themselves, and Russia's historic thirst for empire is continuing to drive its behavior. France and Germany were so committed to renewable energy they've greened themselves into the weakest possible strategic position. Germany became virtually totally dependent or Russia for gas in the past year when we weakened our petroleum extraction, transport and refinement capacities. Russia annexed portions of Crimea in 2014, giving Russia a warm water port - we did, essentilly nothing. So, in this round, they annex portions of/most of/all of Ukraine (sound like Hitler and Czechoslovakia? mebbe?) without significant resistance. It isn't illogical to think that Poland might be next.

I don't know what the US can do. We handed Putin the leverage we had when we throttled back our petroleum production. Stategically, I don't see how we think that we can engage the Russians in Eastern Europe when we don't have control of the seas, or the air, and would be facing an enemy with significantly more sophisticated armaments than the Taliban/Isis/Arab Brotherhood. We cerainly don't have a political establishment that has given any glimmer that we can project a cogent will to defend Ukraine - or a desire to do so.

I just appears that our foreign policy is to stand around telling the Russians - "Stop it, you big bully. Shame on you!" Our next step will probably to register a complaint - obviously. in the strongest possible terms to - the UN General Assembly.

(Nice one with the Peter the Great shot, Mike.)

 

[IlliniApp]

We don't need our military deployed beyond our borders for any reason other than to deter aggression and enforce international rule of law. If we are going to stand idly by while Russian troops redraw the borders of Europe then we might as well bring them all home because you are right, we have been totally emasculated. I don't believe Vladimir Putin has any legitimate security concerns regarding NATO expansion, he just looks in the mirror every morning and sees Peter the Great staring back at him.

I don't get all the sabre-rattling on Ukraine. I grew up in the Eighties when the Cold War was hot and right or wrong I always feel we should stick it up Russia's yin-yang whenever we have the chance but there are some times when it doesn't make sense. Right or wrong, the decision was made years ago to not let Ukraine in NATO because it was viewed that it would needlessly antagonize Russia. How did we react when the Soviets tried to put missiles in Cuba? You don't think Russia would react the same way? Or what if they tried to form an alliance with Mexico? We would view it as a major threat. I'm all for giving Ukraine material assistance if they are invaded. But is it really worth it to go to war over Ukraine with another nuclear power? If they threaten Poland or some of our other NATO allies that would be entirely different, and I doubt they would do that. Same with Taiwan-wtf are we going to do about it if China invades? If they threaten S. Korea or Japan, its a different story. As for the bolded part "we don't need our military deployed beyond our borders for any reason unless it's in our national interest" is the correct way to look at it. We already spend too much $$$ being the world cops.