Virgina REAB and Portal Petition

[Don Clark]

One would think on face USPAP only governs directly the appraiser. Yet, indirectly a connection can be made to State Appraisal boards and Federally Regulated Institutions for appraisers to comply with USPAP.

Carney,

As you well know, some appraisal boards exempt their board members, and their investigators who are also appraisers, from USPAP compliance.

Also, you cannot compel non appraiser members of state appraisal boards to comply with USPAP. And, if an appraiser is ever charged with violation of USPAP by an appraisal board due to use of any portal, and that board has exempted itself and it's investigators from USPAP compliance, the appraiser would have one hell of a good case IMNSHO. But, having a good case does not equate to having the money to fight it in courts.

 

[TJSum]

I have been waiting for someone to post just such a response. Thank you.

If it is acceptable to deliver the true copy in a format other than what I supplied the client, then for a report delivered in AIReady format, why couldn't I just print out the version of the report created in my native forms software? Why is it acceptable in one situation, but not for AIReady? Why does AIReady have a different set of rules to play by?

That is the entire argument in a nut shell. PDF may not be an exact copy, but it is more like a "captured photo" of the report done in the native software. With the conversion programs like AI Ready and Lighthouse, changes to the content are made and can be seen.

 

[Marcia Langley]

One of the hardest concepts for some to grasp, especially those who have never seen AIReady actually work, is that it is a medium that is very different from paper, and its dynamic properties cannot be reproduced on paper any more than a video can.

If it is acceptable to deliver the true copy in a format other than what I supplied the client, then for a report delivered in AIReady format, why couldn't I just print out the version of the report created in my native forms software? Why is it acceptable in one situation, but not for AIReady? Why does AIReady have a different set of rules to play by?

Danny,

Now I'm wondering if you think the term "true copy" should be eliminated from USPAP because you believe there is no such thing. That is, if you are not looking at the original (which it is debatable whether that would be the version on the appraiser's screen or the version on the client's screen) then you really can't be sure if you are seeing the real deal.

It seems we are headed to a conclusion that if there is no such thing as a true copy, anyway, then even major differences must be OK.

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If I made a written report with an imbedded video and did not use any conversion software I would be confident that I could send the board an electronic PDF file (either through email or US mail a disk) that would give them access to a true copy of both the written portion and the video portion. Their access would be through the use of technology that is universally available. They could operate the dynamic link and could view the dynamic content of the video.

I could also send that same report through the US mail as a paper copy of the PDF of the written portion and a disk of the dynamic video portion and the board would have access to both through universally available technology. The dynamic link to the video would not be present in the paper copy of the PDF.

As I understand you, a similar condition exists with AIReady in that the Snagit-able screen shot could be compared to the PDF and the scrolling cell could be compared to the video link. so I guess the main difference is that the information that the link/cell leads to is dynamic in the case of the video and written in the case of the AIReady report.

So a logical analogy would be to keep a PDF of that cell content as that part of the true copy.

I would not call it a good analogy to compare that with the native software PDF. Too many changes besides that dynamic cell have taken place.

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But that comparison does not address the other "dynamic" parts of the converted file; those parts that are imbedded by the conversion software that are unknowable to the appraiser and results in his lack of confidence that he even knows what the client has received.

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In the case of a PDF with an imbedded video that has not gone through conversion software, the appraiser is confident in what is sent and what is received.

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I think there is still a case to be made that an appraiser who can not know what the client has received is in violation of USPAP.

 

[DWiley]

I think there is still a case to be made that an appraiser who can not know what the client has received is in violation of USPAP.

I hope not, or we are all in a lot of trouble. It has been a long time since I hand delivered a report, and that is the only way to know what a client receives - and even that does not control what they do with it after they receive it.

 

[Bearslide]

Marcia - thank you for your very well thought out questions and observations. You speak most eloquently for all of us with concerns.

Good news arrived in the last 3 orders I received this week - different clients, but all saying the same thing. Reports to be submitted in PDF format through THEIR website (NOT FNC) - AND they listed all the major brands of appraisal software acceptable to them - BUT - did not list AIReady. Hopefully that is a sign that sensible clients have concerns about this software as well.

 

[Fred]

What is the difference between "submitting' a report and "sending or delivering".

I asked first.

but it is up to the State Board to determine what format the report is to be delivered to them upon their request.

Yes, if they are making up their own rules. No, if they are enforcing USPAP.

 

[Fred]

With the conversion programs like AI Ready and Lighthouse, changes to the content are made and can be seen.

Content?

When I look at Std 2, I see content requirements like a statement of intended use, user, type/defintion of value, etc? Are you telling the software changes that content? Changes the intended use from mortgae lending to condemnation? Changes the defintion of value from market value to salvage value? Does it change the value conclusion? The HBU conclusions? Declining market to stable?

I don't use the software, so I don't know. But you and Doug have now posted that it changes the content? I'd like to know more about the breadth and frequency of such changes.

 

[Bearslide]

If, as Mr Wiley is stating, AIReady does not lend itself to printed copies, then that IS an issue for any appraiser using AIReady to produce a copy for a state board or any other legal entity. But that aside - let's just say the loan based on an AIReady report goes south and now the lender wants a field review. How does the lender produce the report to be reviewed?? And how is a copy provided to the borrower?

 

[TJSum]

Content?

When I look at Std 2, I see content requirements like a statement of intended use, user, type/defintion of value, etc? Are you telling the software changes that content? Changes the intended use from mortgae lending to condemnation? Changes the defintion of value from market value to salvage value? Does it change the value conclusion? The HBU conclusions? Declining market to stable?

I don't use the software, so I don't know. But you and Doug have now posted that it changes the content? I'd like to know more about the breadth and frequency of such changes.

#1 - I use Clickforms, far less than 1/2 of the available forms convert via AI Ready. It has been a long time since I have used it so I can not remember each and every form whether they convert or not, but Greg Boyd recently posted the CRS did not convert. What does one do when their report contains this page? For my experience many exhibit pages will not convert, various photo pages, Table of Contents, etc. This issue can be worked around for the most part, the appraiser just needs to know which pages are actually compliant with the conversion process, but there may be areas that can not be worked around at all such as the CRS.

#2 - Content changes do take place, for example I like to put as much info on the actual report as possible to keep important comments off the Addendum which the typical user never reads. But after converting, these comments some times ARE MOVED off of the URAR and placed on some new Addendum page. The software then adds "See Addendum" to all the "new"blank fields that used to contain my comments.

This one item might appear minor to some, but when changes like that are made, it no longer feels like my report which contains my signature.

The main issue is, there are enough changes seen during the conversion process, how much time does each appraiser have to waste re-reading and re-proofing the report to make sure all changes are caught and determined to be acceptable before the appraiser clicks on the send button.

The reason some of us (and most of the world) consider PDF as home base is that it just takes a picture of the document so that anyone can read it and/or print it without any special or unique software. It is not an exact copy because it is just a picture of it. With the conversion programs, it actually makes changes to the report in two ways, by the pages that can be used and by actually moving words around (content) within the report.

 

[Fred]

#2 - Content changes do take place, for example I like to put as much info on the actual report as possible to keep important comments off the Addendum which the typical user never reads. But after converting, these comments some times ARE MOVED off of the URAR and placed on some new Addendum page. The software then adds "See Addendum" to all the "new"blank fields that used to contain my comments.

That's s a content change. Sounds like a change of format.

The reason some of us (and most of the world) consider PDF as home base is that it just takes a picture of the document so that anyone can read it and/or print it without any special or unique software. It is not an exact copy because it is just a picture of it. With the conversion programs, it actually makes changes to the report in two ways, by the pages that can be used and by actually moving words around (content) within the report.

I understand. I would probably feel the same way. However, that's a long way from establishing there is automatic and systematic change of content that renders the appraiser incapable of producing a true copy.