What if......

[Dale Floyd]

What if all taxes were eliminated and the government put a simple transaction fee of $2 per electronic transaction in place instead? Time to think outside the box.

​

2023
Digital Payments

USA - 2.04 T (2023)

GLOBAL - 9.47 T (2023)

2027
Digital Payments (projected)

USA - 3.53 T

GLOBAL - 14.79 T

 

[Bobby Bucks]

Taxation is theft, any move that lowers the amount of taxes paid is positive.

 

[J Grant]

What if all taxes were eliminated and the government put a simple transaction fee of $2 per electronic transaction in place instead? Time to think outside the box.

​

2023
Digital Payments

USA - 2.04 T (2023)

GLOBAL - 9.47 T (2023)

2027
Digital Payments (projected)

USA - 3.53 T

GLOBAL - 14.79 T

A mandatory fee per electronic transaction is still a tax.

 

[cashcatz]

What if all taxes were eliminated and the government put a simple transaction fee of $2 per electronic transaction in place instead? Time to think outside the box.

​

2023
Digital Payments

USA - 2.04 T (2023)

GLOBAL - 9.47 T (2023)

2027
Digital Payments (projected)

USA - 3.53 T

GLOBAL - 14.79 T

Everyone will just move to crypto and cash, then. But you bring up an interesting point. A friend of mine thinks speculative trading transactions should be taxed. I haven't examined that very closely but am always interested in different ways to tax as I truly believe progressive income taxes are evil and actually counter-productive (and don't achieve their stated goal of soaking the uber-rich, as they have capital gains instead of W2 income ).

 

[alebrewer]

Has to be a consumption based tax. Otherwise, and to CP's point, you're disincentivizing the wrong things.

 

[cashcatz]

Has to be a consumption based tax. Otherwise, and to CP's point, you're disincentivizing the wrong things.

I think a progressive consumption tax is a very interesting idea worth considering. I.e., basics have no to little tax (groceries, etc) while the more luxurious products are, the more they are taxed. You can also control/shape certain behaviors this way by taxing "bad" things more which already happens at the state level. Though, the accounting could be very complex and how things get taxed and at what rates subject to lobbying.

 

[alebrewer]

I think a progressive consumption tax is a very interesting idea worth considering. I.e., basics have no to little tax (groceries, etc) while the more luxurious products are, the more they are taxed. You can also control/shape certain behaviors this way by taxing "bad" things more which already happens at the state level. Though, the accounting could be very complex and how things get taxed and at what rates subject to lobbying.

And... consumption based tax disincentivizes consumption. Which results in folks saving more. Which results in lower costs for investment funds. Which results in more infrastructure. Which results in a stronger economy.

 

[J Grant]

And... consumption based tax disincentivizes consumption. Which results in folks saving more. Which results in lower costs for investment funds. Which results in more infrastructure. Which results in a stronger economy.

If people spend less to avoid paying a transaction fee, and consumption shrinks, the economy shrinks. Who is going to pay for the infrastructure?

Some people will save instead of spending. I suspect, however, that many people will spend black market style - using cash, buying abroad, or using crypto. It would be a disaster - the govt, already broke, would be underfunded. Who will pay for the military if there is a shortfall?

 

[alebrewer]

If people spend less to avoid paying a transaction fee, and consumption shrinks, the economy shrinks. Who is going to pay for the infrastructure?

Good question. The market clearing price for goods and services will most certainly fluctuate initially. The component you overlooked, however, is the cost of money (i.e. the interest rate). As savings rates increase, that means there's more money to be loaned. More of any good means the cost of that good goes down (generally speaking). In this case, the good is money and the cost is the interest rate. Lower interest rates spurs economic growth. So that, in the long run, the consumption shrink by disincentivizing spending is offset by the healthy market due to relatively lower interest rates.

Some people will save instead of spending. I suspect, however, that many people will spend black market style - using cash, buying abroad, or using crypto. It would be a disaster - the govt, already broke, would be underfunded. Who will pay for the military if there is a shortfall?

How is that different than folks operating in the black market now to avoid income taxes? And stop with the hysterics. Its unbecoming.

 

[J Grant]

Good question. The market clearing price for goods and services will most certainly fluctuate initially. The component you overlooked, however, is the cost of money (i.e. the interest rate). As savings rates increase, that means there's more money to be loaned. More of any good means the cost of that good goes down (generally speaking). In this case, the good is money and the cost is the interest rate. Lower interest rates spurs economic growth. So that, in the long run, the consumption shrink by disincentivizing spending is offset by the healthy market due to relatively lower interest rates.


How is that different than folks operating in the black market now to avoid income taxes? And stop with the hysterics. Its unbecoming.

You are something. I answered as rationally as you did, preventing my point of view, and you call it hysterics. I should not have gone down the rabbit hole with you. I;ll let someone else waste their time.