What to do when you KNOW something is wrong

[Steve Owen]

How does an appraise determine if a comp check is way out of line?

Mike, I think you simply misunderstood this issue. The question is not whether the value estimated in a comp check request is out of line. If an MB asks for raw data, a limited appraisal, or anything else the appraiser can do, that is not out of line.

However, the simple fact is, most MB's asking for a "comp check" are really asking for pre-determined value. As an investor, and as you apparently do not do mortgage broker work as an appraiser, you probably don't understand exactly what is happening on a daily basis to those who do.

What happens is this: MB calls for comp check "just want to see if it will come in before I order the appraisal." (What part of "pre-determined value" did you not understand?) If the appraiser is honest and ethical, he or she may try to turn it into an order by providing raw data or offering limited appraisal services. Sometimes that works, but if the phone monkey is really just looking for pre-determined value, they hang up and move on to the next appraiser. They keep doing that until they find someone who will promise to bring it in.

That is why turning that address in for a QC check is a good idea. If the value was way out of line and the appraiser did it for pre-determined value, that will show up on review. This is not McCarthyism, and it is not a government program to nail bad appraisers. It is nothing more or less than trying to give some investors the tools to protect themselves. You of all people should appreciate that. (Now stepping off of soap box.)

 

[Ms. Janet]

OK. How about an uplifting, kind word or two for a LO?

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i don't care if you have bs in your posts...............i still love you roger........................

apparently many have missed the irony of the how do you know a comp check is out of line if you don't do a comp check comment................

 

[Mr Rex]

Roger, I have a good friend of over 20 years that is a MB, sends me a few each week. He thanks me regularly for keeping him on the straight and narrow when his peers run with the crowd. It has been a long and difficult road to get to this point, with numerous disagreements along the way. Finally, we have agreed on one thing, he trusts me to give him a honest value, and doesn't shop his appraisals. I do his work and if the numbers work, it goes through, if not, its on to the next one. Lenders, buyer, MB and appraisers are all protected. Its really simple if you think about it. I appreciate your post here, and don't want you to stop, but you might want to put the specs on backwards every once and a while, and gain a new perspective(or old since you were once an appraiser) and drop the MB lobby persona. I have been warned by the mods to back off, I hope this is mild enough.

 

[Ms. Janet]

and................there is the possibility that you misunderstood steve................although it seems pretty clear to me...........

and ftr...........i'm an appraiser

Comp check requests where the value wanted in way out of line is a very good address to send!!!!!

A brief explanation of what kicked up the red flag to you would be nice, but is not necessary.

Everyone that sends me an address with or without an explanation of why they believe something is wrong in that deal is protected as I re-list the addresses in a separate email from me to my list.

 

[JSmith43]

i don't care if you have bs in your posts...............i still love you roger........................

apparently many have missed the irony of the how do you know a comp check is out of line if you don't do a comp check comment................

Thanks for the cover. I was really hoping someone would love me for my bs as well

Mike: You don't have to back off with me. You're comments are fine, IMO.

I don't much think about a MB political position when I post, but I sure don't believe in tar and feathering everyone that hasn't been tarred and feathered recently. So, yes, I am opposed to regulatory/punishment solutions and prefer market based solutions. I was opposed when I made a livng as an appraiser as well.

 

[Non Sequitur]

However, the simple fact is, most MB's asking for a "comp check" are really asking for pre-determined value.

Amen. They really don't give a darn about market value, it's just "what appraiser will make my deal work". The order is contingent on the "number" needed to grease the paper through. Maybe the comp check is USPAP compliant, but is the actual order USPAP compliant since it was contingent on another order that determined "value" was there?

A question for those who comp check. Has a MB ever sent a deal over when the comp check came up short? Does it happen often?

FTR all Pam is doing is putting suspect addresses in front of people who say they care, thus in a sense putting the ball in their court. If they're all about stopping preasure and smoked appraisals, lets see them put up.

 

[Pamela Crowley (Florida)]

I don't know, nor care to even attempt to understand, the motivation(s) that make some of you so against this. I'll address the 'comp check' issue, then let's please continue without that issue and just stick to reporting addresses where your KNOW something 'fishy' is going on.

How often do the comp checks come in written form now??? OFTEN!!!
So, you get a written comp check, ignore it and throw it away?
Or, take a look at the potential comps to see how inflated they want it???
Where is the 'appraisal' when there is no client and no appraisal has been delivered????? It's in the appraiser's mind only!!!

I've seen numerous posts here about orders with outrageous values on them where appraisers turn down the assignment just because of that inflated value on the order form. The order isn't even asking for a 'comp check', but the appraiser turns the order down because of that inflated value wanted on it.

How many here don't understand that those orders are all about 'skippy fishing'?????

Comp check and/or high value wanted orders that are turned down, but where the appraiser does do a quickie 'comp check' that has no client and no delivered appraisal report - oral or written - is fair game for turning that address in for a 'watch list'.

I most especially want the addresses where an appraisal was done and the client yelled and you know they will be, or have, gone skippy fishing and will be, or have, found skippy for that deal.
I want the addresses of properties, like the one Susan K has a long thread about, where you KNOW the contract or the deal is inflated and/or includes fraud and games that are illegal.
I want the addresses of properties that have a contract or sale way above the last listed price, or where they want you to be 'blind' and ignore needed repair issues, etc.

You ALL know what I'm talking about here. There is NOTHING illegal or that would constitute a USPAP compliance issue with this. Just give me the addresses and those whose job it IS to research and detect fraud will either find it or not. This just lets them know which files should have a closer look by someone that knows what to look for. The feedback I've had so far is excellent and those I'm dealing with on this are the people whose job it is to review/audit files anyway. This points them in right direction. Almost every address I've turned over to them already has been 'profitable' for them and they are loving this.

Don't participate if you don't want to. Those that want to clean up the ranks of appraisers, and MBs/LOs while they're at it, will participate.

 

[DTB]

I don't know, nor care to even attempt to understand, the motivation(s) that make some of you so against this. I'll address the 'comp check' issue, then let's please continue without that issue and just stick to reporting addresses where your KNOW something 'fishy' is going on.


Don't participate if you don't want to. Those that want to clean up the ranks of appraisers, and MBs/LOs while they're at it, will participate.

My apologies, I thought this was a discussion format. Feel free to take your ball and go home now.

 

[Pamela Crowley (Florida)]

I think I explained the issue of comp checks and turning in an address without a value attached pretty well. If you have more question about that, please do ask them. I'm more than willing to consider others opinion on this and answer.

If you want another discussion regarding comp checks, please feel free to start another new thread about it. If you have something you'd like to discuss here regarding comp checks and how they would relate to turning in an address only of a property an appraiser feels is being set up for potential mortgage fraud, then please do express how you feel about that they might relate to one another.

This thread is all about a new way to help stop mortgage fraud, and along the way to help all the honest appraisers that are being harmed by the way so much mortgage fraud is being perpetrated. IMO, the comp check issue is separate.

The 'Public Trust' all appraisers are mandated to pay attention to is what is being taken care of by what I'm doing. Agree or disagree, post your opinions about THIS subject here or start another thread about a different issue elsewhere.

Everybody has the choice to take their own ball and go home - or break the Forum Rules enough times to be forced to do so. This forum welcomes all opinions, as long as they are expressed within the Forum Rules.

 

[DTB]

Do you know where and what is be turned in to the "authorities"? And why the big secret? If they really want the info, setup a website, announce it to all appraisers on the ASC website and have at it.

I hope this benign question warrants an answer.