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Judge Rules Appraiser/Lender Owe no duty of care

Carnivore said:
I wonder if this is the Appraiser that is the topic of this thread

This month, we're excited to shine the spotlight on Texas appraiser Brock Sivertsen, one of our elite appraisers! In the last 90 days, Brock has completed over 100 orders with an impressive overall turn time of 6.28 days.
Click to expand...
I'd like to congradulate doctor Optometrist for performing thousands of heart surgeries with an average operation time of 10 minutes. At $200 each he is making $1,200 an hour and you can too!
 
Mike Ault said:
I'm disappointed that we've devoted so much time to this..
Click to expand...
So am I. Disappointed amongst numerous other words to describe the appraisers reactions on this site compared to others.

To quote you from a previous post on this site entitled, What does it mean to protect the public trust?

https://appraisersforum.com/forums/threads/what-does-it-mean-to-protect-the-public-trust.236041/

"It's not okay to let your profession be run into the ground by clients seeking the fastest and cheapest ways around you. It may be "reality", but it's far from "okay". Independent valuations are a vital component of our nation's financial system."

"Appraisers must not allow clients to constrain the scope of work to such an extent that it affects the credibility of the report.

"we're all so misinformed that we don't understand what's actually happening to us."

Yet not one of you used this, as appraisers blog did, as an example to save your sinking profession.

https://appraisersblogs.com/lack-of-fee-transparency-exposing-the-AMC-exploitation/

This post clearly separates the ethical from the spineless and anyone boasting about giving her "double barrels" defending an appraiser who produced an appraisal with over 20 deficiencies definitely falls into the later.

Ethical appraisers know "It is apparent to me that the appraiser allowed the AMC, Class Appraisals, to pressure them to complete the report quickly which leads to errors in the reports."

And the same appraisers attempting to deflect their responsibilities onto the borrower can be found commenting and confirming the unethical practices of this very lender and AMC on this site.

Ethical appraisers know "The appraisal report is prepared for the Client and FHA not the buyer and it is not the buyers’ responsibility to find or cure defects in the appraisal or the home inspection."

Yet appraisers on this site spewed intended user clause bs.

Anyone who spent their time seeking out the borrowers address and publicly posting it instead of posting a comment in the most recent CFPB docket to save what's left of your profession definitely falls into the later.

That same person seemed surprised that, "Well, when it was posted on Appraiser Blog, she got lots of positive responses from appraisers"

Again, the difference between the ethical and the spineless.

"This is a total failure on the part of the appraiser, Class Appraisals (agent for the lender), Lender/Client and FHA and all should be found liable to the buyer. Everyone of these parties profited from this transaction at the expense of the buyer. This is a miscarriage of Justice."

The hypocrisy on this site is disturbing when you are responding to a borrower rather than a colleague and your profession definitely does not deserve the public’s trust much less provide it.

It can be seen here in a post by Mejappz https://appraisersforum.com/forums/...air-practices-hurting-consumers.238121/page-5

"Kudos to Cindy Chance for finally speaking up about the atrocities against the public trust that are committed by AMCs and Lenders. Kelly Queen of Davids should take note."

"We are committed to getting the message to consumers that appraisers perform an essential function in our economic system, and anything that interferes with the professionalism and quality of an appraisal is a risk to the public. It is sad indeed that many AMCs, put in place to ensure quality in appraisals, are doing just the opposite

Cindy Chance, CEO"

Or here NC Appraising said https://appraisersforum.com/forums/threads/im-not-surprised.238524/page-11#post-3414996

"Send that to the law firm also. Let the lawyers sue them of behalf of the borrowers in a class action lawsuit suit. We have to make the borrower the victim. If enough groups can lobby or raise cane to the right people about how the borrowers are being overcharged, maybe things will change and we could benefit from it..."

and Surf Cat confirmed https://appraisersforum.com/forums/...ical-unworkability.238484/page-4#post-3411572

"The ol AMC carrot on a stick tactic to make the appraiser Mule to keep trudging forward. Cheapest and fastest wins the day"

Instead of finding ways to attack a borrower for discovering and exposing the effects of the lack of integrity in appraising, find a way to stand up to the lenders/AMC’s that force you to commit fraud or work for $200 in order to continue receiving work to feed your families because you are too afraid to speak up. The spineless appraisers have given into the lender/AMC inflating values to unrealistic numbers to the point where home owner ship is almost unobtainable.

Here are some starting points

https://appraisersblogs.com/fight-unfair-AMC-practices-leverage-state-authorities/

https://appraisersblogs.com/apprais...ce-council-exposes-disturbing-AMC-violations/

Because as seen in the lack of recourse in my situation and as confirmed by Glen Walker, on a different colleague to colleague post of course,

"There is no such thing as public trust when the public is not considered the Client. The borrower has no control over who he/she employs to do a job for them."

And a few more references from an ethical appraiser focused on the real issue asking for names of players to be exposed in order protect the public rather than attack it,

"The judge should have a better understanding that a financed buyer literally can not purchase a home as is in this regard, because it did not meet MPR minimum property standards as defined by HUD and the lender whom underwrote the loan. Please state the specific company names of all parties involved for the public record."
https://www.usa.gov/mortgage-company-complaints
Related. Minimum property standards.
https://www.investopedia.com/articles/mortgages-real-estate/11/FHA-minimum-property-standards.asp
https://www.HUD.gov/sites/dfiles/OCHCO/documents/4000.1hsgh-011823.pdf
Control+F for the search tool / Keyword; Septic.
https://www.FHA.com/fha_article?id=531

Even more insulting is the time you spent here deflecting when you've confirmed on this site that you are aware of the following.


"Fannie doesn't give lenders the option of delivering loans to them with "potential issues". They force the appraiser to identify them and the lender to correct them prior to delivery. That's why appraisers need to be diligent with that process, they are the only thing standing between the lender selling "their risk" on to Fannie improperly and will definitely be targeted if noncompliance ever comes to Fannie's attention. Including filing complaints against the appraiser's license with the state. Lots of clients put improper pressure on appraisers to ignore serious defects and the first time the appraiser "balks" at the prospect they are replaced."

Like Mike said you're all so misinformed that you don't understand what's actually happening to you, and this post that has over 15k views defending the appraiser or deflecting to the borrower, yet the CFPB's open docket period regarding what you're being paid by AMC's that fuels this incompetence received 973 comments proves it.

https://www.regulations.gov/docket/CFPB-2024-0021

Happy Appraising
 
So you're smart enough to note that most of those complaints are about the fee, but instead want to chalk up the business conditions to appraisers not working for the borrowers? Especially when the courts are acknowledging the point that the appraisal isn't being performed on behalf of the borrower.

Pro-tip; when appraisers are complaining about the prevalence of AMCs gobbling up large percentages of the work and making appraisers compete with each other by fee that isn't an argument that is oriented to the interests of home buyers who are not party to the appraiser-client relationship.


They teach critical thinking courses in college, you know.
 
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Bayouplace713 said:
So am I. Disappointed amongst numerous other words to describe the appraisers reactions on this site compared to others.

To quote you from a previous post on this site entitled, What does it mean to protect the public trust?

https://appraisersforum.com/forums/threads/what-does-it-mean-to-protect-the-public-trust.236041/

"It's not okay to let your profession be run into the ground by clients seeking the fastest and cheapest ways around you. It may be "reality", but it's far from "okay". Independent valuations are a vital component of our nation's financial system."

"Appraisers must not allow clients to constrain the scope of work to such an extent that it affects the credibility of the report.

"we're all so misinformed that we don't understand what's actually happening to us."

Yet not one of you used this, as appraisers blog did, as an example to save your sinking profession.

https://appraisersblogs.com/lack-of-fee-transparency-exposing-the-AMC-exploitation/

This post clearly separates the ethical from the spineless and anyone boasting about giving her "double barrels" defending an appraiser who produced an appraisal with over 20 deficiencies definitely falls into the later.

Ethical appraisers know "It is apparent to me that the appraiser allowed the AMC, Class Appraisals, to pressure them to complete the report quickly which leads to errors in the reports."

And the same appraisers attempting to deflect their responsibilities onto the borrower can be found commenting and confirming the unethical practices of this very lender and AMC on this site.

Ethical appraisers know "The appraisal report is prepared for the Client and FHA not the buyer and it is not the buyers’ responsibility to find or cure defects in the appraisal or the home inspection."

Yet appraisers on this site spewed intended user clause bs.

Anyone who spent their time seeking out the borrowers address and publicly posting it instead of posting a comment in the most recent CFPB docket to save what's left of your profession definitely falls into the later.

That same person seemed surprised that, "Well, when it was posted on Appraiser Blog, she got lots of positive responses from appraisers"

Again, the difference between the ethical and the spineless.

"This is a total failure on the part of the appraiser, Class Appraisals (agent for the lender), Lender/Client and FHA and all should be found liable to the buyer. Everyone of these parties profited from this transaction at the expense of the buyer. This is a miscarriage of Justice."

The hypocrisy on this site is disturbing when you are responding to a borrower rather than a colleague and your profession definitely does not deserve the public’s trust much less provide it.

It can be seen here in a post by Mejappz https://appraisersforum.com/forums/...air-practices-hurting-consumers.238121/page-5

"Kudos to Cindy Chance for finally speaking up about the atrocities against the public trust that are committed by AMCs and Lenders. Kelly Queen of Davids should take note."

"We are committed to getting the message to consumers that appraisers perform an essential function in our economic system, and anything that interferes with the professionalism and quality of an appraisal is a risk to the public. It is sad indeed that many AMCs, put in place to ensure quality in appraisals, are doing just the opposite

Cindy Chance, CEO"

Or here NC Appraising said https://appraisersforum.com/forums/threads/im-not-surprised.238524/page-11#post-3414996

"Send that to the law firm also. Let the lawyers sue them of behalf of the borrowers in a class action lawsuit suit. We have to make the borrower the victim. If enough groups can lobby or raise cane to the right people about how the borrowers are being overcharged, maybe things will change and we could benefit from it..."

and Surf Cat confirmed https://appraisersforum.com/forums/...ical-unworkability.238484/page-4#post-3411572

"The ol AMC carrot on a stick tactic to make the appraiser Mule to keep trudging forward. Cheapest and fastest wins the day"

Instead of finding ways to attack a borrower for discovering and exposing the effects of the lack of integrity in appraising, find a way to stand up to the lenders/AMC’s that force you to commit fraud or work for $200 in order to continue receiving work to feed your families because you are too afraid to speak up. The spineless appraisers have given into the lender/AMC inflating values to unrealistic numbers to the point where home owner ship is almost unobtainable.

Here are some starting points

https://appraisersblogs.com/fight-unfair-AMC-practices-leverage-state-authorities/

https://appraisersblogs.com/apprais...ce-council-exposes-disturbing-AMC-violations/

Because as seen in the lack of recourse in my situation and as confirmed by Glen Walker, on a different colleague to colleague post of course,

"There is no such thing as public trust when the public is not considered the Client. The borrower has no control over who he/she employs to do a job for them."

And a few more references from an ethical appraiser focused on the real issue asking for names of players to be exposed in order protect the public rather than attack it,

"The judge should have a better understanding that a financed buyer literally can not purchase a home as is in this regard, because it did not meet MPR minimum property standards as defined by HUD and the lender whom underwrote the loan. Please state the specific company names of all parties involved for the public record."
https://www.usa.gov/mortgage-company-complaints
Related. Minimum property standards.
https://www.investopedia.com/articles/mortgages-real-estate/11/FHA-minimum-property-standards.asp
https://www.HUD.gov/sites/dfiles/OCHCO/documents/4000.1hsgh-011823.pdf
Control+F for the search tool / Keyword; Septic.
https://www.FHA.com/fha_article?id=531

Even more insulting is the time you spent here deflecting when you've confirmed on this site that you are aware of the following.


"Fannie doesn't give lenders the option of delivering loans to them with "potential issues". They force the appraiser to identify them and the lender to correct them prior to delivery. That's why appraisers need to be diligent with that process, they are the only thing standing between the lender selling "their risk" on to Fannie improperly and will definitely be targeted if noncompliance ever comes to Fannie's attention. Including filing complaints against the appraiser's license with the state. Lots of clients put improper pressure on appraisers to ignore serious defects and the first time the appraiser "balks" at the prospect they are replaced."

Like Mike said you're all so misinformed that you don't understand what's actually happening to you, and this post that has over 15k views defending the appraiser or deflecting to the borrower, yet the CFPB's open docket period regarding what you're being paid by AMC's that fuels this incompetence received 973 comments proves it.

https://www.regulations.gov/docket/CFPB-2024-0021

Happy Appraising
Click to expand...
You told us that "the appraiser cropped out pictures of the deck" because it didn't have a handrail. Do you still stand by that statement?
 
Mike Ault said:
You told us that "the appraiser cropped out pictures of the deck" because it didn't have a handrail. Do you still stand by that statement?
Click to expand...
I said the appraiser cropped the deck out of the pictures because the handrail does not meet rail height requirements.

Height Requirements: Railings, especially those on decks and balconies, must meet specific height requirements (usually around 36 to 38 inches) to ensure they provide adequate security and prevent over-the-edge accidents. Spacing Standards: The spacing of balusters (the vertical components) in railings is also key.

https://bayou-mortgage.com/FHA-rail...gs, especially those,in railings is also key.

The incompetence is rampant!
 
Bayouplace713 said:
I said the appraiser cropped deck out of the pictures because the handrail does not meet rail height requirements.

Height Requirements: Railings, especially those on decks and balconies, must meet specific height requirements (usually around 36 to 38 inches) to ensure they provide adequate security and prevent over-the-edge accidents. Spacing Standards: The spacing of balusters (the vertical components) in railings is also key.


The incompetence is rampant!
Click to expand...
Why wouldn't you post a picture of that and the "defective fence" then?
 
If the lender is sufficiently dissatisfied with the appraiser they'll sue the appraiser to recover damages. And the appraiser gets what they get for their errors.

The allegation that nobody cares if the appraiser committed errors is unfounded. We care. Where the disagreement comes in is in whether or not the appraiser's financial responsibility extends past the client and user to a party who was neither the appraiser's client nor one of their users. That's a separate question, and in this case the judge has already issued a ruling based on the law as it currently exists. That the law exists in this form is not the fault of any appraiser - we don't write or enact laws.
 
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Mike Ault said:
Why wouldn't you post a picture of that and the "defective fence" then?
Click to expand...
Mike you've already confirmed on this same post you've seen it.
Mike Ault said:
I feel the need to point out that the MLS pictures in 2021 show a great handrail around the "mystery deck". And "the fencing around this subject" which was visible in the MLS pictures appeared serviceable..
Click to expand...
So now you tell me, does the railing height and baluster width look like it meets the requirements? No need to reply

Please spend your time saving your profession rather than making up things a borrower was required to do.
 
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