Just finished the 15 hour online USPAP course from McKissock

[Voltaire]

I had a great day. Very busy as I like to be. You did not misunderstand me at all. There is no prep for taking the 50 question proctored exam. No review. You are tested on what you learned taking the 15 hour exam, which in my opinion is now a joke.

Just for laughs and giggles I will send a link to this discussion to TAF so they can see the quality of online education.

Great! Fifty questions is all it is? It should be a piece of cake then. What is this 15 hour exam you speak of? That sounds like a doozy of a test! It was my impression that in the beginning when people from your generation wanted to become appraisers they just had to simply hang a shingle outside, is this not the case?

I'm glad that you are going to share this with TAF, but I'm sure they are already aware of the value of online education as roughly 80% of the AQB-approved courses listed on their Web site are Web-based courses. When you think about it, online education is superior in many ways. You have easy access wherever there is an internet connection, you can go at your own pace, and they have great interactive audio and visual learning tools. Also, there's no commute and you can learn in the privacy and comfort of your own home. With the flexibility and 24/7 course access it simply can't be beat. Far superior to classroom courses that encourage passive learning and aren't tailored to individual learning differences.

Oh also Don, just a quick note. The link to your Website listed on your profile brings me to a blank page. I was able to find your Website, however, and I think you did a great job it looks very good.

Voltaire, you asked for feedback regarding the exam: If you understand USPAP, you will pass easily. You asked for a recommendation on study materials: I recommend that you go straight to the source and read USPAP and particularly the FAQ's. These may seem like simplistic answers, but they are not. Don stated, "No wonder we get 1,000's of questions from posters on this forum concerning USPAP ..." Many of the questions show that the poster has not actually read USPAP. For those of us who have invested a great deal of time in understanding USPAP, it is a slap in the face when someone implies that 5 hours might be sufficient. We may be capable of civil, unbiased discussion, but feel that the appropriate response is a harsh retort.
Welcome to the forum, to the AI, and to the profession.

Thanks for the feedback Greg, you and Don have made me rest easy as I understand USPAP quite well and am happy to hear the exam is only 50 questions. I will be sure to review my USPAP book and the FAQ's prior to my exam. Thanks for the welcome I hope one day I will be able to contribute something to this forum too!

 

[JTip]

JTip: I can confirm that the Mckissock pages are timed per page, requiring you to click and read each individual line. Also, they are approved for the state of South Dakota.

I took 24 hours a couple months ago from McKissock. What's nice is that the appraiser credits also apply to your real estate CE in Pennsylvania, two in one shot. For a nominal fee, McKissock sends documentation for both. I had a pleasant experience and can honestly say I did pick up some good information, especially from the FHA class.

I prefer to take my USPAP live though. Gives me the chance to rub elbows with the salty dogs and throw out an odd assignment or two for discussion.

 

[Don Clark]

Great! Fifty questions is all it is? It should be a piece of cake then. What is this 15 hour exam you speak of? That sounds like a doozy of a test! It was my impression that in the beginning when people from your generation wanted to become appraisers they just had to simply hang a shingle outside, is this not the case?

I'm glad that you are going to share this with TAF, but I'm sure they are already aware of the value of online education as roughly 80% of the AQB-approved courses listed on their Web site are Web-based courses. When you think about it, online education is superior in many ways. You have easy access wherever there is an internet connection, you can go at your own pace, and they have great interactive audio and visual learning tools. Also, there's no commute and you can learn in the privacy and comfort of your own home. With the flexibility and 24/7 course access it simply can't be beat. Far superior to classroom courses that encourage passive learning and aren't tailored to individual learning differences.

Oh also Don, just a quick note. The link to your Website listed on your profile brings me to a blank page. I was able to find your Website, however, and I think you did a great job it looks very good.




Thanks for the feedback Greg, you and Don have made me rest easy as I understand USPAP quite well and am happy to hear the exam is only 50 questions. I will be sure to review my USPAP book and the FAQ's prior to my exam. Thanks for the welcome I hope one day I will be able to contribute something to this forum too!

I am certified to teach in several states. Assume for a moment that I had only one very sharp student who needed the 15 hour course. As a State Certified instructor and an AQB Certified Instructor, assume that I am teaching that one person the 15 hour USPAP course. If I taught this one student the 15 hour course in less than 15 hours(assume 5, 8, or 10 hours) I would lose my State Certification as well as my AQB Certification.

The 15 hour exam, as you likely already know was a referrence to the final exam for the 15 hour course.

I am going to make a recommendation to the AQB that any online course provided by any distance education/online provider be monitored and the actual hours that is spent taking the online course be noted on any certificate that a student is awarded, and that the AQB recommend that a state only award actual hours the student achieved in taking such course. I realize there will need to be some flexibility, perhaps the same flexibility that is given to a live course be allowed for an online course. For each hour of the course in a live presentation, the actual hours are 50 minutes. So, a 7 hour course would have a 70 minute leeway, etc.

Whether or not the AQB would be inclined to agree with me is up to them.

For the record, I do not fault McKissock as a provider. I fault the system that allows such unreliability in the educational system.

Yes, I worked for many years as an appraiser prior to licensing. I was a real estate broker, franchise management consultant, district director of a major real estate franchise, and have taught real estate and appraisal courses since 1984. I hold appraiser teaching certification #2 in the state of Virginia.

My mentor would not allow me to work independently for well over 2 years when I trained with him in residential and commercial appraisal work. Until the day I left his employ and started my own business he reviewed all of my work before it went out the door.

I am sure I will see your posting often on the forum once you become licensed/certified, and that you will have many questions concerning USPAP, having learned so little in your 5 hour USPAP course.

 

[Voltaire]

I am certified to teach in several states. Assume for a moment that I had only one very sharp student who needed the 15 hour course. As a State Certified instructor and an AQB Certified Instructor, assume that I am teaching that one person the 15 hour USPAP course. If I taught this one student the 15 hour course in less than 15 hours(assume 5, 8, or 10 hours) I would lose my State Certification as well as my AQB Certification.

The 15 hour exam, as you likely already know was a referrence to the final exam for the 15 hour course.

I am going to make a recommendation to the AQB that any online course provided by any distance education/online provider be monitored and the actual hours that is spent taking the online course be noted on any certificate that a student is awarded, and that the AQB recommend that a state only award actual hours the student achieved in taking such course. I realize there will need to be some flexibility, perhaps the same flexibility that is given to a live course be allowed for an online course. For each hour of the course in a live presentation, the actual hours are 50 minutes. So, a 7 hour course would have a 70 minute leeway, etc.

Whether or not the AQB would be inclined to agree with me is up to them.

For the record, I do not fault McKissock as a provider. I fault the system that allows such unreliability in the educational system.

Yes, I worked for many years as an appraiser prior to licensing. I was a real estate broker, franchise management consultant, district director of a major real estate franchise, and have taught real estate and appraisal courses since 1984. I hold appraiser teaching certification #2 in the state of Virginia.

My mentor would not allow me to work independently for well over 2 years when I trained with him in residential and commercial appraisal work. Until the day I left his employ and started my own business he reviewed all of my work before it went out the door.

I am sure I will see your posting often on the forum once you become licensed/certified, and that you will have many questions concerning USPAP, having learned so little in your 5 hour USPAP course.

Don, great to hear your opinions on these issues. If you taught the course online, you wouldn't loose your certifications. You should check into this option if you feel it is something you could handle.

On a side note, how can you assume I've learned so little from my 15 hour USPAP course? That seems like an unfair assumption to make. I hope you have an enjoyable weekend!

 

[Pittsburgh Pete]

Don, great to hear your opinions on these issues. If you taught the course online, you wouldn't loose your certifications. You should check into this option if you feel it is something you could handle.

On a side note, how can you assume I've learned so little from my 15 hour USPAP course? That seems like an unfair assumption to make. I hope you have an enjoyable weekend!

I'm sure Don would be bummed if his teaching certification became "loose." Gotta keep that certification tight!

 

[George Hatch]

Don, great to hear your opinions on these issues. If you taught the course online, you wouldn't loose your certifications. You should check into this option if you feel it is something you could handle.

On a side note, how can you assume I've learned so little from my 15 hour USPAP course? That seems like an unfair assumption to make. I hope you have an enjoyable weekend!

Don can make such an assumption because he's been teaching the subject for a long time. He knows from experience that MOST appraisers don't really make the connection between the abstracts in that course and the realities of their daily appraisal practice until their 3rd or 4th pass through the material and a few thousand hours out in the field. He also knows that MOST people can't absorb 15 hours of instructional material in 5 hours. He knows that when teaching a live course he has to actually jam a little to properly cover all the material in that length of time.

Here's a word of advice: The test of this material that counts isn't the one with 50 multiple-choice questions.

BTW, nice sideswipe with your implication that Don's too old to understand the use of technology. I mean, he must have stuck to his IBM Selectric back when we switched over to computers, right? He must be writing his Forum posts on papyrus scrolls and sending them via carrier pigeon to Codgers-R-Us to have them transcribed to this forum.

I predict that if you ever do make it through the 5-year introductory phase of your career you'll come to recognize how limited your perspective is right now.

 

[Brian Weaver]

Don makes an excellent case. I think that Illinois may have revisit this issue as well. As it is now...the Board is putting an end to ALL on-line QE starting in 2011.

 

[incognito]

I'm with Don and George on this one. I do not teach USPAP, but I have taken it 14 times since 1989. The Appraisal Institute does not even offer an online USPAP course, because it is felt (I believe) that in class instruction is to important for this class. Every time I take the course, I learn something new, something I am certain I would not have picked up with an online class.

I needed 5 hours to renew my state license this week. I have over 80 hours of advanced Appraisal Institute CE coursework (classroom), but unfortunately Florida does not approve much of it for state CE, and some is just over 2 years old. So I did the unthinkable and signed up for the AI online FHA course, which is approved by Florida for 7 house of CE. I took the course, chapter quizzes and all, in under 1 hour, and passed every quiz 100%. Of course, I teach FHA appraising classes, so I would Expect that I sdhould be able to...

My point is that I am not opposed to flying through an online CE course, but USPAP should just not be one of them.

 

[CANative]

I took the course, chapter quizzes and all, in under 1 hour, and passed every quiz 100%. Of course, I teach FHA appraising classes, so I would Expect that I sdhould be able to...

When I was going to college on the GI bill there were times when I needed a couple of units to get the full time payment. So I'd take the beginning and intermediate guitar courses. I'd already been playing for ten years (we did a lot of Eagles and Arlo Guthrie stuff out in the Indian Ocean). Easy couple of units. I'd pretend not to know how to play while we were being taught how to make an A chord.

 

[Caligirl]

It really is too bad that the thread has downgraded to snipes and bad feelings.

I have taken some courses online, which were a necessity for me to keep my certification. What I mean is, that I needed to renew while I was pregnant with my daughter, Sophie. I was 7 months pregnant, had torn abdominal muscles, my back was spasming, and I developed pitted edema. I also had to use the restroom every 15-20 minutes. If I'd had to complete my CE requirement in the classroom not only would I have been in extreme discomfort I would have disrupted the entire class every 15-20 minutes and missed out on valuable instruction time.

Prior to that, I took the 7-hour USPAP update online because once again I needed to renew and I had to have hip surgery resulting from torn cartiledge in my hip socket due to athleticism in my youth that year. I was on crutches and in pain for about 2 months. Because I was taking painkillers I could not drive myself to classroom educational offerings. Before the surgery I was in chronic pain and had trouble sitting and getting out of a chair, and going up and down stairs. All in all a very bad year for CE.

There is a need for some online education. I still believe that the best education is classroom based, especially for more intensive courses such as advanced capitalization, and USPAP. I do learn something new, at least one or two things, every time I take a USPAP course. And, sometimes the war stories allow for a 'teachable moment', they are not all time wasters.

There is a happy medium. I think Mr. Clark doesn't like the potential for online ed to be misused. He is a valuable member of the forum and a credit to the profession.

Just my two cents. A good day to you all.