Treasury Department Recommendations

[J Grant]

Being outnumbered and outgunned never stopped us before!

This time is different, because what sustained us on residential lender side was govt regulation and now we have an anti regulation and anti consumer protection administration... this law sweeps away regulation for appraisals. I did not vote this admin in but many on the board did; how do they like dismantling regulation when it dismantles their own income ?

The other problem appraisers face both residential and commercial is AI and "big data", which has grown over past few years and AI programs are used for commercial applications now, they are great at number crunching . Appraisers will still be needed but to what extent and how much the fees or available work will be impacted..we have a 2-3 year window at best for lender work before massive change. I don't think massive change can occur overnight would disrupt things too much, but the new products will be fed into the system and each year will see less and less full appraisals..

I've tried several times on the board to see if appraisers were interested in pooling resources to get a national base web pretense and develop online outreach to public linked to the sites such as Zillow =if appraisers can expand menu of services to public such as online chat consulting, short form appraisals done fast for offers and listings and preparing appraisals for contract contingencies we might have an opportunity but we have to make that happen.

 

[Carnivore]

Contracts usually state the terms in time (days) as to when buyer needs to apply for financing and I’ve yet to see a date extend beyond 10

Interestingly I have thought this Due Diligence portion of the Standard Realtor Contract Clause. How did that come about? Why does it even exist as a standard phrase?

I guess what I am asking who wanted this to be in the Contract. Was there some huge outcry by the Sellers? Did they Demand this clause be in the contract?

i think this must have been driven by the Large Lenders and Realtors to hurry up buyers and sellers. In other words "git r done" I want my money and I want it now!

Part of that clause requires the Buyer put in place all the things, I.E apply for loan, make sure there is an appraisal ordered in time etc Huh hello the buyer cant order the appraisal. So buyers are known to drag their feet! OK, so what I say! Its their money! Its their decision, not yours, not mine, not the Realtors, not the Lenders it rest solely on the Buyer! Live with it. If they default on the contract then so be it! Thats between the Seller and the Buyer.

Do you all see the connection here. Fast Appraisals, instant credit checks, instant everything ...Maybe just maybe the Buyer really does not want whats going on either or at least slow the process down.

Reminds me of a Car Dealership!

 

[J Grant]

Interestingly I have thought this Due Diligence portion of the Standard Realtor Contract Clause. How did that come about? Why does it even exist as a standard phrase?

I guess what I am asking who wanted this to be in the Contract. Was there some huge outcry by the Sellers? Did they Demand this clause be in the contract?

i think this must have been driven by the Large Lenders and Realtors to hurry up buyers and sellers. In other words "git r done" I want my money and I want it now!

Part of that clause requires the Buyer put in place all the things, I.E apply for loan, make sure there is an appraisal ordered in time etc Huh hello the buyer cant order the appraisal. So buyers are known to drag their feet! OK, so what I say! Its their money! Its their decision, not yours, not mine, not the Realtors, not the Lenders it rest solely on the Buyer! Live with it. If they default on the contract then so be it! Thats between the Seller and the Buyer.

Do you all see the connection here. Fast Appraisals, instant credit checks, instant everything ...Maybe just maybe the Buyer really does not want whats going on either or at least slow the process down.

Reminds me of a Car Dealership!

This is an opportunity for appraisers (if we are smart enough to take it ) to develop a national appraiser website platform such as Zillow has ( and link traffic from Zillow et al to us), because yes buyers are being rushed by lenders now and it is not in the buyer's or borrower's best interest many times for such lightening speed and no appraisal or a ridiculous hybrid done by a bleary eyed staffer pumping out desk work and a non licensed inspector running from property to property.

The public has a need for appraisals now and online consulting services now due to changes like this and due to zillow and Redfin now having direct buying and selling platforms and waivers creating a need for appraisals to fulfill a contract contingency

 

[Non Sequitur]

Being outnumbered and outgunned never stopped us before!

I like the spirit, and hope appraisers who have that "can do" attitude put up their money and join an org like the ASA, AI, AGA, etc. or start mingling with other appraisers either at the local level or attending one of several conferences.

Back to your "...never stopped us before!" That implies victory, what are the victories? Licensing? HVCC? Dodd-Frank? C&R? The near constant changes and tinkering via USPAP and the AQB? It's all a matter of perspective, but IMO residential appraisers can't claim much success on the battlefield.

 

[Renee Healion]

Mine was a sardonic remark but I thoroughly support your call for people to do something and not just talk.

 

[Meandering]

Interestingly I have thought this Due Diligence portion of the Standard Realtor Contract Clause. How did that come about? Why does it even exist as a standard phrase?

I guess what I am asking who wanted this to be in the Contract. Was there some huge outcry by the Sellers? Did they Demand this clause be in the contract?

i think this must have been driven by the Large Lenders and Realtors to hurry up buyers and sellers. In other words "git r done" I want my money and I want it now!

Part of that clause requires the Buyer put in place all the things, I.E apply for loan, make sure there is an appraisal ordered in time etc Huh hello the buyer cant order the appraisal. So buyers are known to drag their feet! OK, so what I say! Its their money! Its their decision, not yours, not mine, not the Realtors, not the Lenders it rest solely on the Buyer! Live with it. If they default on the contract then so be it! Thats between the Seller and the Buyer.

Do you all see the connection here. Fast Appraisals, instant credit checks, instant everything ...Maybe just maybe the Buyer really does not want whats going on either or at least slow the process down.

Reminds me of a Car Dealership!

RE sales contracts = "time is of the essence".

Been there as long as I've known.

Buyers dragging, drags sellers, and visa versa. Everyone needs time frames so that each can plan a move.

.

 

[Non Sequitur]

I won’t deny it - This whole thing causes me concern. Too many guns aimed at our profession these days.

Step back a few minutes and don't look at this through appraiser colored glasses. The whole ecosystem is being transformed, of the 223 pages less than 4 full pages deal with appraisers/appraisals, I think we need to put that into perspective and possibly reach out to other groups being automated out of existence. I was in the title business before appraisal, that business has been hammered with little to no sympathy extended from anyone. IMO we're on the same path if we don't look at the whole and plan accordingly.

 

[Non Sequitur]

Regardless. None of what you outline is on the appraiser.

Didn't say it was, but like it or not that has to be factored into any survey/study purporting to measure the time it takes a lender to order an appraisal after receiving the contract. With that said, the information would be interesting to have but I seriously doubt any of our clients would be willing to participate. But I'll say this, my personal experience with that process measured the time to order in hours, and I'm confident the VaCAP numbers are a joke.

It’s the front end that’s broken and which ASA’s letter was addressing.

I don't fault the ASA for the letter, I'm faulting VaCAP for promoting what amounts to false news.

We can’t be responsible for a lender or borrowers lack of due dilligence

I've always been amazed and disturbed by the whole "F-them it ain't my problem" attitude many appraisers have toward their clients. Here's a reality check: IT MATTERS. And if we don't reach out and at least try to work with and move forward with our bread and butter clients they will move forward without us. It's this simple: lenders don't exist to service residential appraisers, we exist to service them. And poop rolls downhill along with that "F-Them" attitude, like it or not we're at the bottom of the hill.

 

[glenn walker]

This time is different, because what sustained us on residential lender side was govt regulation and now we have an anti regulation and anti consumer protection administration... this law sweeps away regulation for appraisals. I did not vote this admin in but many on the board did; how do they like dismantling regulation when it dismantles their own income ?

The other problem appraisers face both residential and commercial is AI and "big data", which has grown over past few years and AI programs are used for commercial applications now, they are great at number crunching . Appraisers will still be needed but to what extent and how much the fees or available work will be impacted..we have a 2-3 year window at best for lender work before massive change. I don't think massive change can occur overnight would disrupt things too much, but the new products will be fed into the system and each year will see less and less full appraisals..

I've tried several times on the board to see if appraisers were interested in pooling resources to get a national base web pretense and develop online outreach to public linked to the sites such as Zillow =if appraisers can expand menu of services to public such as online chat consulting, short form appraisals done fast for offers and listings and preparing appraisals for contract contingencies we might have an opportunity but we have to make that happen.

It's called Home Advisor and lot's of appraisers are on it !

 

[J Grant]

I like the spirit, and hope appraisers who have that "can do" attitude put up their money and join an org like the ASA, AI, AGA, etc. or start mingling with other appraisers either at the local level or attending one of several conferences.

Back to your "...never stopped us before!" That implies victory, what are the victories? Licensing? HVCC? Dodd-Frank? C&R? The near constant changes and tinkering via USPAP and the AQB? It's all a matter of perspective, but IMO residential appraisers can't claim much success on the battlefield.

What can joining more organizations accomplish ? Yes joining is always good but it is more of the same, fighting an old battle rather than developing a new income stream not tied in to govt lending and all the regulatory issues which are now marginalizing us.

Every appraiser could join every organization tomorrow and it won't affect what is happening at the federal level -nor the technological changes accelerating)

Appraisers need to stop devoting so much of their/our energy, focus, and resources around legislation and that includes a false hope of what appraisal organizations can do at this point.

Appraisers if they are to survive and thrive needs to use technology, not be wiped out by it. In that sense appraisers ( perhaps hiring or partnering with an entrepreneur tech visionary ) need to start up their own innovation to get direct work from the public on a national scale through a public outreach website platform modeled after Zillow , that could provide some innovative products for consumers , borrowers, buyers and sellers such as online chat consulting about offers, short form appraisals done on the cloud or a website proprietary form as well as offering traditional appraisals for all needs and especially for appraisal contingencies in contracts.

If we don't do that, if we stay invisible such as title agents were, we will be marginalized by the tech advances as lenders use them more - what we should be doing is devoting our resources and focus to a shared effort of seizing the moment while we still have time (and income from res lending work ) to replace it as it shrinks...we need to cast aside our differences and any personal feelings on the board of some posters toward others and develop an outreach beyond lender work to serve all of us.