Virgina REAB and Portal Petition

[Fred]

The way I read this thread there are two extreme camps. Extreme camp A wants to eliminate data mining. Extreme camp B wants to preserve datamining.

I haven't read any post I construe as in favor of what you call data "mining." I am not in favor of tornadoes either. I am just opposed to "solutions" that increase problems.

so it takes more than a programmed machine to value a property

I don't think you will find anyone to disagree with the spirit of that, but you might you might be surprised to learn that what gets called "AVM" on this forum is a lot more than a programmed "machine."

This gets to a larger issue of lack of research that Mr. Wiley has hinted at. Just look at the phrase "data mining." In the real world, that means studying and analyzing data to find what it means. On this forum, it means "stealing" what is supposedly someone else's data (as if someone can own data).

I think we all agree in one sense or another, there are too many companies in too many types of business that have their hand too far into the pockets of real estate appraisers. AMC's especially are killing the vibrancy of appraisal practices with no obvious benefit to society.

A little good news - the GA REAB has amended that ridiculous wording they had proposed.

Do have a handy link?

 

[Ken B]

Kenneth,

I know you like to think that this is a single-issue thread so I guess we'll just have to disagree.

I can respect that.

 

[Ken B]

I am just opposed to "solutions" that increase problems.

I think we all agree in one sense or another, there are too many companies in too many types of business that have their hand too far into the pockets of real estate appraisers.

Bingo. Therein lies my concerns.

 

[woodyva]

SS:

You are very correct. AVM's are more than that, but they are limited inthe same way a desktop appraiser is. Having helped with one being built, and looking at many reports from various AVM's I hav eto say they do work on par with what everyone refers to as skippy work.

These things are great tools for an appraiser to use, after the appraiser has looked at the market in traditional methods. To us ethem for lending as the only valuation in the file is fool hearted and it does hurt the public, sense we are left to hold FNMA's hand. Tax payers are nothing more than the punished for the Goverment's mistakes.
I am gald we can finally agree on something, LOL.

 

[Marcia Langley]

SS,

For the record, I would not consider you in an extreme camp.

I am just opposed to "solutions" that increase problems.

So am I.

 

[DWiley]

Do have a handy link?

At the moment I do not. My information comes from one (of the very few) who attended the meeting.

 

[DWiley]

Both camps seem to have very strong "other agendas."

I have stated my "agenda" many times. I fear Machiavellian activists trying to stop "data mining" at any costs. Not because I am a fan of lenders extracting data from reports, but because the "fix" could inadvertently really screw things up.

Only a handful of people took the time to attend yesterday's meeting in Georgia and point out the consequences of the wording they had proposed. If those handful had not been there, then that state board could easily have inadvertenetly made it illegal to send any kind of electronic report in that state.

In April my state inadvertently made it illegal for an appraiser to testify about a property unless you had appraised the property. If you have only reviewed an appraisal report, and you testify about that review, you have violated the law in my state - at least until we can get it straighetend out in the next session. The state legislature and the appraiser board did not intend for that to be the case, but that is the result of the words they passed.

 

[woodyva]

Danny:

I know you have repeated yourself countless times, so I will try and ask this in a way that you don't repeat yourself:

1-I understand that you don't want to see it made ilegal for reports to be sent electronically, no issue there
2-If webportals are no longer allowed to receive files in limited use type format, ie env, pds, or any other small use format, but are allowed to send out files in a universally accepeted format such as PDF what doe that hurt?

PDF's are capable of being converted on the lenders side either by the lender or the lender's agent. It really does not add any time for either side. PDF's do allow security settings and digital signatures can be embedded, images can be locked down, as well as many other components of the file.

 

[DWiley]

It really does not add any time for either side.

Of course converting to PDF takes time. Many just don't count the time because we are so accustomed to doing it.

PDF's do allow security settings and digital signatures can be embedded, images can be locked down, as well as many other components of the file.

I am sure those committing the fraud that the portal petition is trying to stop would love that idea, Woody. Since you provided an excellent link to Alamode Labs, let me quote from that site:

PDF security is a myth - ANY PDF can be altered in seconds no matter what you've been told

Those are Alamode's words, not mine, though I do agree with them.

http://www.alamode.com/labs/projects/SureDocs/default.aspx

If the issue is somehow tied to the report format, then PDF is the last format we should be defending/promoting. However, many do defend it because it is a format we have all used and some feel very comfortable with, even though it is not secure.

 

[woodyva]

Of course converting to PDF takes time. Many just don't count the time because we are so accustomed to doing it.
quote]


You are right in so far as PDF are as secure as anything else. Security really is a seperate issue, but when you combine a PDF with something like an autheticated file with digital signatures at least you can prove you did the right thing.

I chose security to counter on when I should not have, as you mention it many times as to why we should not use a PDF. Uploading a PDF to a website allows for as secure a delivery as anyone will get.

Even PDS and ENV files are are not 100% secure, all it takes is the ability to have software that reads it. Now that FNC was stupid enough to provide one to the internet for anyone to get I am sure we will find someone has done it. They should have made the viewer available to the subsriber base only, but I don't think they want the actual individual appraisers out here to have a viewer, just web access to one. That is slick, no wthat I think about it.