FHA electrical guidelines.

[mark hurlock]

I suppose it would depend on the house, the type of service, the number of circuits, the number and type of appliances currently in the home compared to "standard" appliances, etc., etc.

Each property is different.

Can,

You're a good sport and probably a decent appraiser based on what you post.

 

[CANative]

.................

 

[Mr Rex]

It really does depend. A 60 amp service would be the most suspect, but might be OK. A house with a gas range, gas water heater, gas heat, and a gas dryer really has a small electrical demand. Change any one or more of those to electric and 60 amps needs some consideration. On the other hand, you prolly could change 2 of those to electric and get by with 100 amps, assuming not a big house.

Ranges draw 40-50 amps, water heaters 20-60 or so depending on size, dryers typically 30 amps, and heat ranges from 20-80 or so depending on size. A/C is usually in the 20-40 amp or so depending on size. Heat and air are probably the hardest to be reasonably sure of without doing some further investigation. Water heaters and the exterior HVAC units typically have the maximum amp draw on the data plate. A little harder with the heat side, since often the resistance heat is an add on to the heat pump system and the data plate on the exterior of the fan/coil unit may not be helpful in a split system. On the other hand, it doesn't take too many baseboard heaters to exceed 100 amps.

In any case, even when figuring loads, the total amperage is not simply added together to deteremine load requirments, but calculate the total wattage requirements. Here is some more reading:http://www.managemylife.com/mmh/questions/107162-calculate-electrical-load-house

 

[hastalavista]

Denis,

There is no basis that I would offer as professional advice to another appraiser. I can tell you that adequate sizing of electrical service equipment is determined by a calculation promulgated by the NEC. I don't recommend appraisers apply it without proper guidance.

I do not recommend that appraisers become electrical engineers for the purpose of valuation. If a particular assignment required the appraiser to eliminate any assumption of adequacy, I would recommend an inspection by a qualified professional.

(my bold)

And I think what I bolded is what FHA expects... and it expects it with the understanding that an appraiser is not an electrical engineer and will not make the calculation based on the NEC standards.
So, the true threshold is not "is the service adequate" but rather, "is it reasonable to require an inspection to determine if the service is adequate"?
That is certainly a standard that an appraiser can meet using his/her experience, common sense, and discussing his/her rationale in the report so the intended use can make a judgment if it is reasonable or can decide it isn't reasonable, and not require any additional inspections.

I'm a simple Marine on the front line. I come up on something which looks like a mine to me. I'm not going to try to defuse it. I'm going to mark it and alert my command what I found, where it is, what I think it is, and recommend they get someone to look at it.
I don't have to make the determination that it is a mine or not.
I just have to use common sense in my determination of advising my command that there is a potential issue.
FHA expects a similar level of common sense in a lot less serious situation.

 

[CANative]

I'm a simple Marine on the front line.

I was NAVY. Never Again Volunteer Yourself. I guess that's the same thing you're saying. :laugh:

 

[hastalavista]

I was NAVY. Never Again Volunteer Yourself. I guess that's the same thing you're saying. :laugh:

Yeah, something like that!

 

[incognito]

When it comes right down to it, Mark, it does not really make any difference what the appraiser calls. Per FHA, the underwriter makes the call. Therefore, I support Can's response of "appears".

A comment such as: "The electric service of 60 Amps (or The glass fuses) do not appear to be adequate to properly and safely serve the needs of the subject property" would be a perfectly acceptable response, along with the APPRAISAL requirement of some type of MPR correction. The underwriter makes the ultimate decision on what gets done.

 

[mark hurlock]

(my bold)

And I think what I bolded is what FHA expects... and it expects it with the understanding that an appraiser is not an electrical engineer and will not make the calculation based on the NEC standards.
So, the true threshold is not "is the service adequate" but rather, "is it reasonable to require an inspection to determine if the service is adequate"?



That is certainly a standard that an appraiser can meet using his/her experience, common sense, and discussing his/her rationale in the report so the intended use can make a judgment if it is reasonable or can decide it isn't reasonable, and not require any additional inspections.

.

I agree with your interpretation of FHA expectations. I was giving Can a hard time and he was a good sport about it.

I disagree with your second thought to accommodate those expectations because there is no standard for an appraiser to apply or any expectation that individual appraisers have the ability to make such a determination. This does not mean if you become aware of a condition that you are not required to disclose it. I believe the practical way to handle the assignment condition is to make very clear in the scope of work what an inspection is and is not and that anything more requires further inspection. But I would not describe anything specific to the electrical system as a basis for others to evaluate, such as, there are three 30 amp bla bla bla therefore, bla bla bla.

 

[mark hurlock]

A comment such as: "The electric service of 60 Amps (or The glass fuses) do not appear to be adequate to properly and safely serve the needs of the subject property" would be a perfectly acceptable response, along with the APPRAISAL requirement of some type of MPR correction. The underwriter makes the ultimate decision on what gets done.

I would NEVER make such a statement.

I might make the following statement.

The appraiser is unable to determine if the subject electrical service is adequate and therefore recommend an inspection by a professional.

That is the difference between you and me.

I have always understood it is the underwriter's call.

 

[CANative]

How about:

"Based on my observations, the electric service of 60 Amps (or The glass fuses) may not be adequate to properly and safely serve the needs of the subject property"